Discussion Release Notes version 1.27

[DeletedUser1909]

Considering the changes to the Tourneys, I have come to belive that the changes were made to stop over scouting by depleting beginners resources and manufactured goods. By doing this they really have to stay in the GZ or forego participation in tourneys.

Which intern hurts their boost

 

[Sir Squirrel]

I think it is another way for us to use our goods up so we are trading more. They have been changing a lot of things lately and I think their goal is to get more trades in the trader. Timon said this quite a few times in the last few innotv's and the Q&A's they had recently. The wholesaler was just the start. Maybe we all should start putting up large quantities of smaller trades so they will see we are trading. Not cross-tier trades that's just not nice, lol.

 

[DeletedUser1833]

My L4 Abyss is now just a massive coin producer : it produces more coins than 10(!!) L15 residences, giving me only 3/4 of the population of a single L15. And all I can do with those extra coins is chuck them at the Trader.

 

[SoggyShorts]

d I think their goal is to get more trades in the trader.

Then they should fix player movement
Right now 90% of trades are done within fellowships because our neighbors quit 8 months ago.

 

[DeletedUser1909]

YUP So true on US2 server Knights Charter keeps most 80+% in house by doing 10k and above trades.

 

[Sir Squirrel]

Yeah I am not sure why they think the player movement is actually working, but they must have met whatever goal they had, because both my cities have tons of dead cities that have been there for months as well. And have not showed any sign of making it any better from what I have seen either.

 

[DeletedUser1877]

You know, it would have been (and still would be) fairly simple to have a script that read in any world's DBs, compile stats on how many folk have a particular AW, Compile stats on the village of said folk, and examine the impact of change being considered.

Might avoid the statements that so far seem blatantly untrue like "vast, vast majority" and "some small edge cases".

@Marindor: You said in the beginning of this thread "We will try to prepare you for big changes like the Ancient Wonder rebalancing up front in different ways though. This one e.g. was covered in our last InnoGames TV episode and we have talked about it on the forums lately as well"

Iindeed it was.... we were encouraged to build the GA. Nothing prior to this catastrophe warned us of the impending damage planned for our cities.

 

[DeletedUser1992]

This will most certainly affect a lot of people. I don't know what some of you consider "low level players", but I play on Elycsander, and in Chapter 4, have a level 7 GA, and stayed within GL zone. I used all of my space, upgraded all of my buildings as much as I can, and maxed out my working population - I am using 11,903 of 11960 population. My GA gives 1060 population right now. Under the new GA (assuming my math is correct), I would only get 531.52125 population (531 if rounded down).

See what that would do to me? I would lose 529 population, and I would be -472 population! In order to get the equivalent population from my GA, I would need to have 21744 working population ... I would almost have to DOUBLE my working population. Thats insane. I would like to consider myself a mid-level player, and not low level -- so assuming that only chapters 1-3 players will be affected is crazy.

In order to get to that amount of working population I would need 10844 more population, or 26 more level 15 houses ... at 9 squares per space for a level 15 house, that's 10 more expansions I would need, not including roads I would need.

Oh but wait, I'm not supposed to over explore! And oh yes, I was told that AW would be awesome now and to build and use them! And yes, I know I could "regain" my -472 population by adding a couple level 15 houses, but the point is that this update to "improve AWs" would make mine MUCH less useful.

 

[Dony]

I personally consider people who dont have researched tier1&2&3 level15 manufactories (which is chapter 5) to be low level, after that the game more or less start which is mid range, and last chapter if top, but that just mine gauge

 

[DeletedUser1992]

I personally consider people who dont have researched tier1&2&3 level15 manufactories to be low level, after that the game more or less start which is mid range, and last chapter if top, but that just mine gauge

I don't disagree, but as you can see my "rank" is 3027, out of probably 12,000+ on Elycsander. That means I'm likely in the top 25% of the population of that server. So, even if you use me as a baseline for the "top" person that would be DRASTICALLY affected, then > 75% of the people get the short end of the stick of this update. And how is that supposed to benefit players? And yes, I know not everyone has GA, not everyone levels them, and not everyone uses them to my extent, but my point is that more people will be affected than I think most people think. It is NOT just edge case scenarios.

It is likely only Fairies chapter or above players (maybe top 5%-10% of players? guesses) where this is really cool.

But yeah, Inno could do some simple data analysis to get these answers.

 

[DeletedUser1877]

Several days into this drastic alteration, and we have no words from "above". Are we being heard? Does anyone care? and, what if anything will be done?

 

[DeletedUser]

Actually Ritsel (who was in my FS) quit a few days ago, and said this is yet another reason to stop playing her beta account, so saying she quit over this is a little misleading.

@SoggyShorts Sorry, I guess I should have stated my reasons for quitting better.

My main reason for discontinuing my city on the beta site was the impossibility to fight in both provinces and tournaments. When the event started I tried to cater, but that left me bankrupt on goods. Trade has always been a problem, because my discovered Wood-elves and Sorcerer neighbours still find it necessary to only offer 0-star trades (and never return a visit for NH).

Therefore, my city was starting to become beyond repair. No goods, no room to build more factories, very low on culture because of the bug, no goods even to upgrade my roads, no change to win the big prizes in the events (which would have boosted my culture and population). The drop of population in my GA has made things even worse, because I won’t be able to replace the low-culture buildings with population attached to it.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m still having a blast with my Sorcerer City on the Dutch server, mainly because such a large city is strong enough to take some punches. But with my mid-range Beta-city I did my best to follow the guidelines concerning all the changes …. and failed disastrously in building a prosperous city. Maybe I would have managed if the changes didn’t came so quickly in a row. Sadly, I [edit: no] longer feel capable of keeping up, and there’s no fun anymore in continuing to struggle. Therefore, I'm calling defeat.

 

[SoggyShorts]

It is likely only Fairies chapter or above players (maybe top 5%-10% of players? guesses) where this is really cool.

At the start of chapter 6 with a level 2 GA it's pretty good. Upgrading a workshop from 15 to 16 should cost 136 pop, but I instantly get 6 pop back since my GA gets better.

There's a good chance from what I've read here that somewhere in chapter 5 is the change-over from bad to good, probably because every building shoots up to max level 15 drastically increasing working pop.

Having players in chapter 1-4 (5?) being negatively effected is too much, and any one of the suggestions above should be able to fix it.

Event quests have the "scout 2 provinces OR upgrade 2 buildings quests", so a similar "gives 410 pop OR x.x% of working pop, whichever is higher" should be possible and will only effect those hurt by the update.

 

[DeletedUser1877]

Only lets me give you ONE like Soggy, but several are warranted

 

[DeletedUser1992]

There's a good chance from what I've read here that somewhere in chapter 5 is the change-over from bad to good, probably because every building shoots up to max level 15 drastically increasing working pop.

Having players in chapter 1-4 (5?) being negatively effected is too much, and any one of the suggestions above should be able to fix it.

It also depends on the level of the GA. For me (GA level 7), I likely won't get an equivalent GA until I'm in chapter 6, when I get Dwarven style residences, and can increase my houses to above level 15. You can't increase working pop until you increase base pop, and that either requires more houses or higher level houses (or pop-based event buildings). I COULD also dump about a thousand or more KP into my GA and get it higher, but not sure its worth it right now.

Dwarven style residences is 34 techs away for me right now. In that time I get 7 more tech expansions, and probably at least 4 province rewards ... so I *guess* I could get an equivalent pop from my GA towards the end of chapter 5 if I use all 10-11 expansions for JUST houses and roads, to give me the required 24+ houses I would need to get the necessary working population.

Of course, that wouldn't work either, because all of my upgrades to use the increased population would mean bigger buildings, so the increased space COULDN'T just be houses.

 

[SoggyShorts]

Wow, level 7 GA seems high for chapter 5. To get enough runes for 2 rings and 1,000 KP for upgrades is impressive.

 

[DeletedUser1657]

It is likely only Fairies chapter or above players (maybe top 5%-10% of players? guesses) where this is really cool.

Without knowing the average working population at each era it is hard to say. One thing we do know is the lower your level the lower you GA needs to be to reduce chance of impact. This is a strong disincentive to level a GA and I am unsure exactly where that balance is. @Marindor Is it intended that people only have certain level wonders at set eras? This seems to be the case for the gold abyss is that intended or just a product of the change?

Several days into this drastic alteration, and we have no words from "above". Are we being heard? Does anyone care? and, what if anything will be done?

Have some patience, it is weekend now for a start. The last few updates Muf-Muf and Marindor have provided responses and updated the first post. Remember the process won't be super fast as they have to wait a bit for comments to collect a bunch of feedback which they need to compile, then forward it, then wait for a response, then type that up for us. With the change in beta updates I am unsure if this will extend that time as there will be more additions to this update so they may wait for more additions and feedback before forwarding.

There's a good chance from what I've read here that somewhere in chapter 5 is the change-over from bad to good, probably because every building shoots up to max level 15 drastically increasing working pop.

It all depends on your era (working population) and the level of your GA. I have a town just starting era 5 and am currently -1200population after update. I haven't worked out how much more working pop I would need but I doubt I will get it in era 5 due, but maybe...

 

[DeletedUser1526]

i have no clue why developers hate new players so much

Devs hate ALL players, and why it is beyond me...

At least now we know not to rush to build any more AWs, as they might get changed in ways that do not benefit our towns, or even hurt us.

This is the main reason why people should think twice before they spend real money here, Inno sells one thing and then that thing becomes something completely different from what it was.

whenever they change this game, it is for future new players only, and those who are already here and somtimes invested real money into the game get treated like crap

So true.

 

[DeletedUser1992]

Wow, level 7 GA seems high for chapter 5. To get enough runes for 2 rings and 1,000 KP for upgrades is impressive.

Chapter IV, and yes, I'm pretty impressed with myself that I got it done, lol .

Of course, I spent time on it because I value my space and I got awesome population out of it............. Which I currently stand to lose for several chapters .

 

[DeletedUser1993]

Dear Humans and Elves,

Please see the Release Notes of our current game version, including the first Ancient Wonder rebalancing here and let us hear your thoughts about it in this thread!

Kind regards,
Your Elvenar Beta Team

So now, a small town player is requested to save and spend 155 knowledge points to (as in my case) get a population increase of 12? I don't care what the intention with the rebalancing was, this can not be the answer. After the disaster with the combat, now this. It seems like an effort to make the game un-attractive to new players, and one that is working!