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Why Orcs are needed after 10th provinces circle?

  • Thread starter DeletedUser1548
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DeletedUser629

Guest
I totally agree. I guess all the well versed, college educated and well respected (in real life) people ... mean squat here. Time to close shop and call THIS game and company a wash. I wish them well; without me of course. Too bad 1 person leaving will make no difference.

People's backgrounds are irrelevant, and it makes no sense to even mention it. By saying this, you are implying we should all listen to you, because of who you are in real life. Every player is equally important, no matter their status.
 

DeletedUser118

Guest
The background might be irrelevant but the outcome is the same. Ppl in here don't feel heard, even ignored. I don't think that's something that should happen at a place where its part of the game to "say something".

Besides, I don't think Irishna wanted to put herself above anybody else. Instead she more felt like being called "dumb" and wanted to show that she or others are not at all "dumb ppl".

Easily explained, if you tell somebody you think what he's doing is wrong and he shouts at you no its not, its you who are just too stupid to understand it. Wouldn't that make you feel insulted as well? I think that's what many ppl feel like at the moment, especially after some of your comments Goryn.
 

DeletedUser1546

Guest
I think the fact you posted this explains a lot... Are moderators supposed to be a voice between the customers and the game devs/employees or, are you just here to say what you like or try to calm the mob of unhappy people asking valid questions?? I'm not really even trying to be a smartka@# here. I honestly want to know because from all my reading in these forums, a couple mods seem a bit rude rather than helpful.

Do you know how many people are leaving the game because of the subject of this post??? I have had 3 guild members leave already with others contemplating the same! We are (soon to be were) the number 1 guild on our server...and this is killing the game as of this moment...and we are trying to get your attention...and you respond as RUDELY as you can get away with????? Really????
 

DeletedUser629

Guest
The background might be irrelevant but the outcome is the same. Ppl in here don't feel heard, even ignored. I don't think that's something that should happen at a place where its part of the game to "say something".

Besides, I don't think Irishna wanted to put herself above anybody else. Instead she more felt like being called "dumb" and wanted to show that she or others are not at all "dumb ppl".

Easily explained, if you tell somebody you think what he's doing is wrong and he shouts at you no its not, its you who are just too stupid to understand it. Wouldn't that make you feel insulted as well? I think that's what many ppl feel like at the moment, especially after some of your comments Goryn.

There is nothing wrong with my comments here. I explained how things are, i explained how to win fights, but feel free to show me a comment of mine where i acted as if another person was dumb.

The reality here, is that some people are easily offended, but at the same time, have absolutely no problem with being offensive themselves. It works both ways. If you want me to give a normal response, start by asking a question in a civilized manner.


Do you know how many people are leaving the game because of the subject of this post??? I have had 3 guild members leave already with others contemplating the same! We are (soon to be were) the number 1 guild on our server...and this is killing the game as of this moment...and we are trying to get your attention...and you respond as RUDELY as you can get away with????? Really????

Again, i have not been rude anywhere. Yes, we are aware of the fact that many players do not like the Orcs needed in provinces, and as i have said a few pages back, we are looking in to this at the moment.
 

DeletedUser118

Guest
Ok, as I don't have the time anymore today, I will go through this thread by tomorrow morning to see if I can find some of the questions you want to see. I have no problem with that. Of course if somebody wants to do it in meantime, he/she's free to do so.

Though "TL;DR" doesn't really sound like you are taking that post by Irishna very serious, Goryn. Also, weren't it some of your posts too which had to be deleted by Muf-Muf in another thread where you had an argument with some players? I don't think ppl are "imagining" things in here when they say you sometimes seem to be a little "too much offtopic", to call it in a friendlier way.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
It is a shame, that once again, the discussion is derailed to this. It is a vicious cycle in this forum, one that discourages players from givinh valuable feedback.

1- Inno asks for feedback about changes
2 - players respond with said feedback
3 - if said feedback is negative, players are ignored/insulted/treated in a patronised/sarcastic way ( take your pick, they are all true).
4 - discussion stops being about the changes in the game and becomes about how bad the mods here are and how the players feel they are not heard.
5 - players give up on giving feedback until the next awful change in the game is made, and everyone feels they should try again to get through to Inno, after which we are back at step 1.

In the meanwhile the game loses quality and players and no one wins...
 

Elderflower

Well-Known Member
I am another who doesn't do fighting. I built one armory and upgraded it all the way because I like to see all the different buildings in my city. But I've never used it until now when we have to create orcs with it. Now the quest wants me to spend a whole lot of time and resources building another because I can't decline the quest that says you have to have 2 of level 16 or higher. Does this mean I have pretty well come to the end of the game for me? Or does it not matter if I don't do this quest. I guess what I am asking is does anyone know if I will be blocked from continuing the game at some point because I haven't completed this quest?
 

DeletedUser629

Guest
There are players who can't complete the main quest, or don't want to. You can continue the game but remember. If you do finish that quest later on, you might get a new main quest that needs certain resources you no longer have.
 

Elderflower

Well-Known Member
Thanks for that. Well I'll just carry on until I am blocked. I don't do many quests anyway. I tend to ignore them and forget about them until suddenly I see a green tick and discover I've completed one without realising it.:p
I'll leave her to twiddle her thumbs in the corner until then. All the best.
 

DeletedUser867

Guest
I have had 3 guild members leave already with others contemplating the same! We are (soon to be were) the number 1 guild on our server...and this is killing the game as of this moment.
I would be interesting to see some demographics for the folks who are "quitting."
  • Quitting a fellowship, and walking away from a stressful situation, is one thing. and those folks may well continue to play at a more leisurely pace.
  • But there are folks who prefer to play in a pressure packed environment, and they aren't interested in slowing down, so there's a good chance that they will, indeed, decide that some other game is more to their liking.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
It is a shame, that once again, the discussion is derailed to this. It is a vicious cycle in this forum, one that discourages players from givinh valuable feedback.

1- Inno asks for feedback about changes
2 - players respond with said feedback
3 - if said feedback is negative, players are ignored/insulted/treated in a patronised/sarcastic way ( take your pick, they are all true).
4 - discussion stops being about the changes in the game and becomes about how bad the mods here are and how the players feel they are not heard.
5 - players give up on giving feedback until the next awful change in the game is made, and everyone feels they should try again to get through to Inno, after which we are back at step 1.

In the meanwhile the game loses quality and players and no one wins...

There a 5b: players are privately censured and threatened with banishment.
 
We're looking into ways to improve our services, we can guarantee you that. It would be appreciated if we could get this topic back to its original subject. Any complaints about any of our staff and/or services can be directed directly to me via either our Support (you can click the "Contact Us" link at the bottom of the forum), or you can send me a private message here on the forum and I will get back to you as soon as possible. We thank you for your patience in this.
 

DeletedUser651

Guest
It would be appreciated if we could get this topic back to its original subject.

At this point we are just spitting into the wind. We have told you the orc requirement comes too early. Players have quit over the issue and ALL your feedback on every thread everywhere is negative (except for Inno employees). What else is there to say? No one seems to want to hear from customers. So why waste our breath? Posts keep getting deleted. How stupid do we have to be to keep telling you things?
 
On the contrary, we do want and value your feedback very much indeed. We are continuously reading our forums and gathering feedback from everyone. We may not always respond to individual threads, but that doesn't mean the feedback is not read and collected.

Either way, we should really get this thread back on track and return to the subject at hand. @ag123 started the thread by asking why the Orcs are needed after the 10th province. Please allow me to explain the reasoning behind those changes. We have to start with emphasizing the need to have perfect balancing in the game: a game that is not properly balanced is no fun to play, after all, and it is our goal to make our games fun to play. We also want to keep our game interesting in the long-term: variations in e.g. the scouting costs help with that (it would not be fun to pay the same resources over and over again until the end of times, after all). With these two problems in mind we decided that we needed to make some changes here: we want to add variety, and we want to make sure that progress on the world map is actually still fun and challenging for you when you progress further into the game.

We realize that implementing this change now is not perfect. In a perfect world, it would have been done this way from the very start, so that we would not introduce it as a new "rule" or "blocker", but rather as something that would "guide" you through your game in the same way that good costs were introduced in the very early game (that is: as a new player, you cannot yet produce marble/planks/steel yet, but they do appear on the world map as negotiation costs). Still, we believe it is very important for the game as a whole to make sure that it's not possible for players to be too far apart, so to say. It would be impossible to design a challenging experience for someone who has only scouted 10 provinces and someone who scouted 300, but who are at the exact same point in the research tree: think about things like the dificulty of battles which are based on the amount of provinces you have already discovered, but which are also greatly influenced by the technologies you have unlocked, such as squad size upgrades and better units.

We are interested in improving on this, as with everything, but we are looking for a way where we can both satisfy your needs, as well as the balancing needs of the game. For that, we are looking for some very specific feedback on this: how is it that you are affected by this problem? What is the source? We believe this could have several causes - we realize that it can be a mixture of multiple, or maybe we missed something entirely. Anyways, the options we thought of are:
  1. you have already scouted all 222 possible provinces for which you do not require Orcs (everything up to and including distance 9), because of various reasons, such as a way to use your resources or a need for further city expansions, and you ended up at distance 10 or further because you do not have distance 9 or lower provinces left to resolve;
  2. you have scouted in a specific direction because you are looking for specific provinces because you need those Relics to boost your production, and you ended up at distance 10 or higher that way, but you still have provinces of distance 9 or lower left;
  3. you have scouted in a specific direction because you were looking to discover certain players (e.g. to have them as trade partners and/or to give them neighborly help), and this took to you distance 10 provinces or further; or
  4. something else that we don't know.

It would help us a great deal in finding possible solutions and considering our options if you could let us know why you are stuck on the world map. Is it for one of the reasons above? Or is it something else? Please let us know why, especially in the last case.

Thanks again so much for your feedback so far, and we hope to read a great deal more after this post as well! We are very much looking forward to your opinions.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
I am personally not affected by this change, but from what my fellows in En say, it is mainly a mixture of the first 3 reasons. Also, i think something that has been overlooked, is the impact the wonders have had in the game for newer players.

Players are now approaching the game differently than the way the early adopters did, they are not racing through tech anymore. Instead, they are building wonders along the way, and spending KPs to get the runes and to level them, which means their progress in the tech tree is much slower.
But they are still sending the scout whenever it is ready, so they are on par with the rest of us in terms of progress in the map, which means, they are a lot more advanced in the map versus their progress in the tech tree. This means, they will reach the ring 10 provinces way before they are in the Orcs chapter, making them unable to negotiate anymore, and of course, unable to win the provinces by fighting as well, as they will lack the necessary units.

This should be taken into account, because a player that reaches that point and finds himself blocked from the map for months will most likely quit the game. This change should be tied to progress in the tech tree, as many have said before, so prevent situations like this happening... Make it tied up with the advanced scouts in the orc chapter for example and i think you will have a lot less complains.
 

DeletedUser1075

Guest
Hi Muf-Muf, I fit category 1 in your post above.
1. you have already scouted all 222 possible provinces for which you do not require Orcs (everything up to and including ring 9), because of various reasons, such as a way to use your resources or a need for further city expansions, and you ended up at distance 10 or further because you do not have distance 9 or lower provinces left to resolve

I think what you are missing is the consequences of this block. In my case, if I had been blocked at or near the start of fairy, when I had a lot of elixir and other difficult provinces to get through without being able to negotiate, I would not have been able to complete the fairy chapter because I would not have had the necessary space from expansions. While it does take forever for me to get expansions, even the 2 or 3 I obtain while working through the chapters is helpful.

Some of us are already struggling with expansions, so this hits us particularly hard. Those who were "caught up" on expansions at the beginning of the chapter didn't get as frustrated. It's still frustrating because there are relics and kps at stake in addition to expansions needed for orcs, just not quite as frustrating when in addition to all those things, you're 6 expansions behind and now another 10 have opened. The orcs are a particularly difficult chapter with the huge size increase and rotation of residences, easily the biggest block of buildings in most players' cities.

The orcs come relatively quickly once you start the orc chapter, and I'm back to having the ability to negotiate. It was still very frustrating, more so because I couldn't predict how quickly I could get through, the upgrades to the armories did take significant space, and at chapter open I realized how very far in the hole I was with expansions.
 

Brummbaer

Well-Known Member
Dear Muf-Muf,
my primary problem are not the orcs, it is the high demand on city space for the orc buildings.
I need more than 30 days to scout 11 Provinces for a province (now relic) expansion. There are 3 city expansion left avaiblable in the research tree and I have space for 15 expansions. I have deleted 2 residences, one silk manufactory and one pond to get some space to build the portal, the orc rally point and 11 mushroom farms. Now I'm waiting for the daily production and looking on the bouncing coins. I'm stuck in research because I can not produce the require mushrooms. The orc chapter extremely slow done the progress of my city building. And on Top the new residences are nearly useless because they do not produce more habitants, only 2 more per residence square, this is not enough for upgrading other buildings. I loose a lot of interest in the game, because I'm not realy able to do something in the meantime.
Greeting Brummbaer
 

DeletedUser1075

Guest
I agree wholeheartedly with what Brummbaer wrote. I am negative 3900+ on culture because I can't shift enough things around anymore to build, and nothing I am willing to delete will help that number significantly. Right now, it makes more sense for me to twiddle my thumbs while I slowly progress through the tech tree until I can build the campground cultural buildings.

I think that for active players who are not buying expansions with diamonds, the game is not balanced in the area of expansions. I have been able to buy two premium expansions with bug-report diamonds and still I'm in the same situation as Brummbaer.

I'd be a lot more excited right now if I were working on filling in the 10 expansion slots opened by the orc chapter, but I am still waiting to fill 5 slots from the fairy chapter.

We need either another way to earn expansions, or we need the current method of scouting and fighting to speed up. Consider this though: if you increase scout speeds 50%, Brummbaer and I still have about 7 months before we can expect to fill our slots at the current speed - which we know is not going to remain consistent during that time. So I no longer believe increasing scout speed is a potential solution to this issue.

It's boring and demotivating to watch your rankings go down just because you don't have space or culture to build anything.
 
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