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Discussion Autumn Zodiac

Beezle Bug

Active Member
I don't like Quests 17 and 31 at all!!
After Inno gave us so many wonderful sets and envolving buildings I placed some of them in my cities (Live server more than beta).

I realized, that this works really good and so I broke away some workshops and manus. On Live Server for example I have only 1 T1 Manu left.
And on beta I have only 2 Workshops left.

So how on earth shall I do these kind of quests in a nearly acceptable time????
(and I will need loads of instants to get the supplies my workshops usually produce ... :-( )

These questtype makes the eventbuildings with good- or supplyproduction a trap for the players who use them.

Please think about alternatives, Inno!!!
And I hope, you find one quickly, so that I don't find these quests on the live servers too when autumn Zodiac arrives there.
 
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Fredd

Member
I do think that the new requirement to use only fully upgraded workshops to fulfill quests unfairly penalizes those who have spent real $$ to purchase Magic Workshops. The whole point of doing that is that you ultimately need fewer total workshops to achieve the same production.
Exactly! Good to know that I will be penalized for spending money on the game .. I'm feeling a complete moron for spending money on magic workshops .. what a disappointment.
 

Dony

King of Bugs
The requirements are balanced
they are not balanced at all, i have 0 workshops on current level, and 2 T1 (i dont need T1 at all so no point to increase that number)
and yet i have same requirements than somebody with 10 T1 or 10 WS. Balanced would be if game took amount of manus and workshops in my city and adjust requirements based on that to make it equal for all
 

Kersepitje

QA Moderator
Elvenar Team
planned on getting 2 brownbear with saving tons of time boosters instead of using them last event (so i got only 2 paradies instead of 6-8). This will not work now so i am sad.
why not? you can use your time boosters to speed up the upgrading of extra workshops/factories to the needed level, if you are considering building extra.
i would suggest: be creative. Try to work your way around this new challenge.

We had a problem with players being able to 'cheat' the system by placing too many workshops and factories then that was intended, this would become a huge problem when we made the quest endless. So we try to tackle this issue on different ways, last event we tried it with 'complete province' quests, this time we try it with current advancement quests.
We feel confident that this approach is better then the last one, and that the players will stay within our desired prize outcome. Only time will tell, we know all of you can be very creative. And if its really as bad as you all think now, we can take that feedback for the next event or even try to adjust some things in this event if that is technically possible. But at the moment im confident that it won't be needed.

PS: also realise that if you win 6 bears, you probably wont be able to get enough pet food to support them all anyway
 

ExplorerFfff

Well-Known Member
@Kersepitje We only have as many workshops and manufactories in town as we need to run tournaments and races. We play events between races in their place. It is not possible to play a month event with our workshops because we need to make full use of them for tournaments. This event strictly punishes strategic players with optimized city.
 

Dony

King of Bugs
things which should be considered:
magic workshops should count as 2 normal workshops to not punish premium players
scout or research should have 3rd alternative as kill last boss on any map in spire (still hard and time consuming which cant be done a lot of time)
5xtoolboxes for current progress should be changed to either reduce the amount or ask for double amount with ws lvl1 (i have no problem with other shorter productions, because its normal to use those for any active player)
 

Kersepitje

QA Moderator
Elvenar Team
they are not balanced at all, i have 0 workshops on current level, and 2 T1 (i dont need T1 at all so no point to increase that number)
and yet i have same requirements than somebody with 10 T1 or 10 WS. Balanced would be if game took amount of manus and workshops in my city and adjust requirements based on that to make it equal for all
so what do you suggest, people who have 0 workshops get asked for 0 productions? Do you really think we would even consider this? it would result in everyone just destroying all their workshops the day before the event starts... :p

we balance for the average player, from what we see in statistics, not for what we 'think' every player should have in his city. I think you understand even more then some others that we cannot do well for everyone. Especially for edge cases when players have 0 workshops or factories or those who have 20+ workshops and 20+ T1 factories and no T2/T3.

Events are as always still optional, if you think its too much work to adapt your city for this event or that the prize is not worth it, then you can just skip the event. If you do think it is worth it, then i can suggest you adapt, think of a strategy that allows you to get as much as you can, consider this a challenge - something many people have been asking for. This event is only on day one, plenty of days to come where you can adapt.

If i were in your shoes, i would start building, and use timeboosts to hurry up the construction. And then maybe focus on a day with timeboosts as daily prize to compensate for the time boosts invested or even use those to hurry construction up even more.
Or do with what you have and use the time boosts to hurry up the production. Plenty of options...
I could make more suggestions but its not my job to tell anyone how to play, play as you feel, and be creative!

PS: my main account also has a strategic setup, with few workshops (magical) and few factories. So don't think i don't feel your pain or dont get what you mean. Im also in your shoes
 

Heymrdiedier

Well-Known Member
magic workshops should count as 2 normal workshops to not punish premium players
totally agree, feels wrong to punish those who support the game
scout or research should have 3rd alternative as kill last boss on any map in spire (still hard and time consuming which cant be done a lot of time)
Also agree, we complain every time we get this quest, and i think they even fixed it in the past by adding 'or collect xx vision dust' to this quest. Don't get why they forgot about that adjustment

5xtoolboxes for current progress should be changed to either reduce the amount or ask for double amount with ws lvl1 (i have no problem with other shorter productions, because its normal to use those for any active player)
i don't like the lvl 1 alternative you suggest, i hate all those lv 1 things in my city. And if they consider it they would have to be at least x5 just like the encounters have a tournament encounter x5 alternative.
Im thinking maybe a max level of workshops for those quests is also fine, right now you need a lvl 30 WS in the last chapter, maybe if lvl 20 WS
was the highest required for any quest, it would be better. Right now it just take too long to upgrade 1 WS to lvl 30. So its hard even if we wanna 'adapt'.
5 toolboxes, i dont know if i think thats too much or not, 4 or 3 feels almost the same. Think the point of the devs is to make us not prepare that quest, and only start the production once we get it. (So we loose a whole day, intended)
 

Dony

King of Bugs
so what do you suggest, people who have 0 workshops get asked for 0 productions? Do you really think we would even consider this? it would result in everyone just destroying all their workshops the day before the event starts...
this is pretty easy to fix, game can store data every single day when decay happens, how many of manus and ws do you have, and you can average that for a month before even event starts, no cheats possible, but on other hand it makes experience unique to your city and balanced overall, not hard to do, just more intuitiveness and brainstorming is needed on dev side
If i were in your shoes, i would start building, and use timeboosts to hurry up the construction. And then maybe focus on a day with timeboosts as daily prize to compensate for the time boosts invested or even use those to hurry construction up even more.
Or do with what you have and use the time boosts to hurry up the production. Plenty of options...
i have no problem with that, but what i should do with that useless buildings after event ends? what if this is the first and last time we see this? all resources wasted for no reason, there is no hesitation to delete lvl1 building, but try deleting 1 workshop lvl33 or even 5, thats months of used builders on them
 
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UlyssesBlue

Well-Known Member
we balance for the average player, from what we see in statistics
we cannot do well for everyone. Especially for edge cases when players have 0 workshops or factories or those who have 20+ workshops and 20+ T1 factories and no T2/T3.
The mark of a good game is that it works for a wide variety of play styles, player levels, etc, rather than just railroads everyone to a single play style and punishes everyone who doesn't comply. Just something to think about.
 

Aria Greensleeves

New Member
i kinda like this new challenge, am upgrading extra workshops on all the accounts i play :) Hope to get a few ready in time, but a lvl 30 workshop takes many, and many days.
Feels like a relief from the usual lvl 1 workshops and factories. I only hope that they ask less production then they used to, because 9 or 10 toolboxes on current advancement workshops is a bit too much. One thing i absolutely love however, is that for factories, that means there cant be 1day and 2 day productions anymore, since you cant make those on all levels. So that makes it easier and less preparing, just a few 3hours and 9 hours productions to set up in advance
Good point! Never thought of that :)
 

shadowblack

Well-Known Member
This is a fine example of what happens when you copy something from one game into another without considering all the differences between the two games. Here are two quests from a FoE event:
"Finish an 8-hour production some (3 - 17) times" and "Pay some (2,100 - 195,000) supplies"
"Finish 18 productions in production buildings from your age OR Finish 20 productions in production buildings from the previous age"
Notice how the first one specifies the time and number of productions, but has no requirement for the age of the buildings? So you can just build a bunch of Blacksmiths for that quest (that's the FoE equivalent of building a bunch of level 1 Workshops in Elvenar).

Notice how the second quest specifically asks for using buildings from your age or the previous age (your chapter or previous chapter in Elvenar terms) but does not specify the type of productions? So you can do 5-minute productions and finish the task in less than 2 hours (and that's if you are in the last age/chapter).

In Elvenar those two quests are combined into one – not only you need to do a specific production, such as Basket of Groceries, but you also need to do it in Workshops from your chapter or the previous chapter.

This brings me to the next major issue: In FoE each age has its own production buildings, so if you need a building from a specific age – you just build one in less than a day. In Elvenar that is not possible – you can't build a (for example) level 30 Workshop. If you want another Workshop from your current chapter, you need to first a build a level 1 Workshop and then SLOWLY upgrade it all the way to the desired level (or you can waste a ton of time boosters to speed up the upgrade).

I can understand the reasoning for this change, but it seems to me like the possible consequences were not fully taken into account.
 

ferrari13

Member
On live I have 0 workshops and 0 T1 manufactories on maxed level (only on lvl 1), so no difference, I need extra space, but I need more for the current quests. A lvl 1 manufactory costs 2 spaces, a maxed one 24 spaces, and I never seen a single quest asks for 36 day 1 productions, so it costs way more now.
For the maufactory quests accept T2, T3 productions as well (so produce X day1 T1 or X day1 T2 or X day1 T3). And for the workshop quests also give some other alternative, like collect supplies X times from event buildings, AWs or maxed workshops (it also works for the manufactory ones: collect goods X times from event buildings / AWs / maxed manufactories). In this way noone will be forced to build there cities in one (and only one) way.
 

Beezle Bug

Active Member
@Kersepitje: ... call me an "edge player", but ...

... on my way I use many of the possibiliies the game offers and I use them intensely.
And you will find me every week in the top 200 tournament - often top 100.

So what is wrong with playing the game by scooping (right word? hmm) the game in all its facets?

This should not be ignored by looking mostly at an average player.

(couldn't quote you, don't know why)