Discussion [Discussion] Fellowship-based tournaments

[DeletedUser607]

regarding FoE.

something that might be really worth looking into with the introduction of the new adjustments to the tournament system:

in FoE, players can win KP packages, and the players can consume them when they need to use them. that would be the case for AW-rewards and now for the tournament reward. for example, if the tournament will be held in the future during the usual time (tuesday to saturday) that means for me, that on saturday evening, my KP counter will stop working because of the KP-reward generated by the tournament.

and a loss of 8 KP (which would be otherwise gained from 4 pm until midnight) can't be the meaning of a reward. it would be a joke.

so, that's one of the things being required for the future.

easiest way to implement it: instead of winning 10 KP, split them up into nice 5KP packages which can be consumed on demand. please don't forget that it is a reward. something that should have only good effects for players, and not bad effects.

 

[DeletedUser1657]

Of course it's expected that a top reward requires top players and a lot of effort. If, considering that fact, you however still feel that it's too hard to obtain them, we can forward that feedback for reconsideration.

This last tournament on Khelonaar the top 25 players totaled 357K (only the top 3 players did 6x6 or more)
A little better on Winyandor with the top 25 players totaling 366K (only the top 5 players did 6x6 or more)
I think the 440K goal might be a little high.

Your too fast Soggy

I checked all of the US and EN servers to see how many players achieved the 17,600 points that would be needed by 25 players in a fellowship. The best server EN2 had 6 people attain this. Across all 7 servers only 28 people reached this number. Granted some did better and could support people with lower totals and granted maybe there will be more motivation with the new system but if only 28 people across 7 servers can get to the number 1 member would need in a full fellowship I hold little hope for the ability to attain the reward.

I am sure the devs have access to far more information on the tournaments and scores and perhaps that last tournament was hard or of little interest but on the face of it this does not bode well. If something appears out-of-reach people won't even both trying

I can agree with the blueprint being of high value and should be of considerable effort to achieve, but I sincerely hope the reward scale is looked at and revised in some way, or change the delay timer down a little (1-2hrs) as that in itself would make it more likely people could do the 6th (and highest point round) while still requiring a mass amount of coordination and effort required by fellowships.

 

[SoggyShorts]

When will you get it that most players who PLAY Elvenar DON'T to battle but play peacefully.

Where did you get those statistics from? Even if many players have turned to negotiating, then the attempts at improving the combat are quite needed, no?

has to be fought manually. Because auto-combat AI is broken [on purpose].

What possible reason could there be to break the AI on purpose? Do you envision INNO employees gleefully watching your autocombats lose?

In fairies chapter and up is impossible to encounter any reasonable amount of provinces and higher levels with just/or mainly with negotiations.

I crushed all of the provinces needed to unlock orcs with negotiating very easily, not sure what you are doing wrong here.

overall 110k TP is most appropriate amount of TP for all chest rewards

This I actually agree with, although the KP rewards might need to be toned down if that were the case.

 

[DeletedUser1695]

This last tournament on Khelonaar the top 25 players totaled 357K (only the top 3 players did 6x6 or more)
A little better on Winyandor with the top 25 players totaling 366K (only the top 5 players did 6x6 or more)
I think the 440K goal might be a little high.
Edit: I just checked, and those top 25 players are scattered across 19 fellowships.

Personally I don't know if the goals are to high, but the expectance of a fellowshipbased tournament seem to have lessened the interest in the present tournaments. At least on the Danish server the numbers is far lower than i remember them to be normally.
Since I reached the full bonus from relics of 700% I haven't taken much interest in them... they are a nice bost to my KP, but nothing more. If I go further than approx 10 tournaments it becomes to expensive in goods or units to achieve more in my opinion the same goes after 4 round as I'm not that interested in more rune shards. I have way more than I can possible use. Thus my personal interest in tournaments aren't that high and I'm stocking goods and units like crazy. more than one million of some of the goods.
Now I lead an active fellowship and i think that in the weeks where we put up an effort we should be able to reach the big prize, but it shouldn't be something achievable every week. Unless I'm much mistaken the present goal of 440k is achievable and a loose guess would be not more than once every 10 weeks, but that will depend on a lot of facts that I don't hold presently.

One of them being the usability of the blueprints. because we only have a few with the magic buildings, and until they can be used by the non spenders it hasn't got a large appeal to them to reach that goal. If something cool is added a lot more appeal is gained and it's a lot easier to assemble the masses in an attempt to reach the goal.

But yes I'm looking very much forward to see how achievable it really is at present levels. We are after alle guessing in the blind

 

[Heymrdiedier]

At least on the Danish server the numbers is far lower than i remember them to be normally.

that might be cause of 2 reasons on live servers, 1 the debuffs arent working making it a lot harder to win when the odds are against you. Secondly the damage range is gone. Both of them combined, make the rad mortar (the human main unit this tournament) a lot less usefull, wich causes a lot of humans to be unable to reach high scores this week.

 

[Dony]

sadly this tournament is devalued by bug where nobody can have points from 6th difficulty

 

[SoggyShorts]

sadly this tournament is devalued by bug where nobody can have points from 6th difficulty

What really? On Beta you get no TP for clearing the 6th star? Wow, I thought it was hard before lol

 

[Heymrdiedier]

sadly this tournament is devalued by bug where nobody can have points from 6th difficulty

is the reward still a rune on the last level?
I personally wont make 6th level due to inconventient start time of the tournament (16h timer wich isnt in sync with live server, and i do need some sleep sometimes) , so i cant see the reward for the 6th leve yet.

 

[Dony]

no you dont get any reward from 6th, after you finish 5th you get reward from 5th and province lock after that as if you did 6th
but yes it shows it should be rune as in old system

 

[DeletedUser607]

@Heymrdiedier actually, due to a bug, you CAN'T do the 6th level. it automatically finishes without reward when completing the 5th lvl.

means 1.5k TP less per province, and @SoggyShorts posting regarding getting the blueprint with just completing the 5th level of the tournament becomes really important.

EDIT: ninjaed by dony

 

[DeletedUser]

Where did you get those statistics from? Even if many players have turned to negotiating, then the attempts at improving the combat are quite needed, no?


What possible reason could there be to break the AI on purpose? Do you envision INNO employees gleefully watching your autocombats lose?

I crushed all of the provinces needed to unlock orcs with negotiating very easily, not sure what you are doing wrong here.

This I actually agree with, although the KP rewards might need to be toned down if that were the case.

AI = broken, stupid, retarded call it whatever you want. It doesn't work. It just run towards opponents (and relay on brute-force).

I was talking about Tournament provinces since this is a tournament topic. The amount of goods you need to negotiate becomes too big. you can't gain enough goods in time to do such thing. You need to start relaying on fighting more and more.

Current chest rewards have a ok-ish amount of KPs. If you win all chests. Trimming down KP rewards... They are already cheapskates with KPs.
As I read people are creating multiple accounts to fill unreasonable AW requirements to gain basically gain "nothing."

Like INNOGAMES don't care or completely ignore correlation between space & time, tho this is exactly the game of spacetime.

Maybe they will surprise us with Chapter 15 calculations - where efficiency becomes a thing.

 

[ophion]

Why...oh why couldn't Innogames have given us a city building game that they promised to us when we came here at the start without the same old battles and battle units that have become the major thing in Elvenar?
Almost all of my fellowship friends are hating all the battles and tournaments, and wish they'd never become a part of this once beautiful city building game. This game held so much promise and was loved by those that had become disillusioned with all the other battle based games out there and gave us a place to be at peace and enjoy. We were constantly told it would never go the way of all the other battle based games and it would remain special?
What Happened???
Every update sees new battle units...that we are no longer able to progress within the game without building them...the introduction of Fellowship Tournaments that most of us are unable to complete, or are made to feel guilty if they don't participate...quests that require us to scout a province when we have already scouted too far and are now being penalised for it...
the list goes on.
Everything that people hate most about this game is the introduction of battles and warfare...and yet the devs go on and on creating new ones at every update and making complicated battle strategies that no one wants.
If you really listened to all the Beta testers of this game you will have learned that already...but when no one wanted battles in Elvenar...they came anyway...and continue to grow with every update.
Elvenar could have been something fantastic...a one of...
but either greed or ignorance...and I'm not sure which....has turned it into just another Forge of Empires with Elven/Human buildings. So sad.(

 

[SoggyShorts]

Personally, I joined because the game offered both city building and combat.

Ideally you would have the option of playing as military, pacifist, or a hybrid.

Right now, combat isn't great- only some players are in a position to enjoy it, so Inno is giving it extra attention. That makes sense to me.

 

[ophion]

Just one Innogame that doesn't have battles in it...that was just a passive city building game was all we asked for...it isn't rocket science.
Every single game that Inno produce has to be about battles and fighting...just give us a break for chrissakes.
Not all of us are 15 years old that play these games and we aren't all looking for testosterone fuelled crap. Some of us are just wanting some time to play a peaceful and quiet/interesting quest based game/with great looking buildings to acquire...and friends to play along with.
Is that so difficult?
I don't want to compete in sodding tournaments, build military buildings that take up space where a nice looking building could go....I don't want to make orcs or have to fight to complete provinces...
Just please give us 1 game that doesn't require any of this and I'll sign up.

 

[DeletedUser1637]

@ophion I totally agree, the fact is that I stopped playing the likes of Grepolis and FoE because I hated that I didn't have the time to ensure that my city wasn't going to be raided or whatever. Elvenar gave us that but now as you have said, it is becoming more battle orientated, which is unfortunate.

 

[DeletedUser1637]

Ideally you would have the option of playing as military, pacifist, or a hybrid.

I'd love for that to happen! As the game states in the info page before you sign up, you can become a trader or a fighter, but alas, one can only become trader if you research battle techs and vice-versa :/

 

[CrazyWizard]

Your too fast Soggy

I checked all of the US and EN servers to see how many players achieved the 17,600 points that would be needed by 25 players in a fellowship. The best server EN2 had 6 people attain this. Across all 7 servers only 28 people reached this number. Granted some did better and could support people with lower totals and granted maybe there will be more motivation with the new system but if only 28 people across 7 servers can get to the number 1 member would need in a full fellowship I hold little hope for the ability to attain the reward.

I am sure the devs have access to far more information on the tournaments and scores and perhaps that last tournament was hard or of little interest but on the face of it this does not bode well. If something appears out-of-reach people won't even both trying

I can agree with the blueprint being of high value and should be of considerable effort to achieve, but I sincerely hope the reward scale is looked at and revised in some way, or change the delay timer down a little (1-2hrs) as that in itself would make it more likely people could do the 6th (and highest point round) while still requiring a mass amount of coordination and effort required by fellowships.

top 25 at our server was 380k

Maybe it's a good idea now to modify the waiting timer to make it easier for many to reach level 6, and see how that works.

but the main issue stays you have to kick every friend from your guild just to build one able to get to the mark.
Since as you can see it's very hard to compensate for lesser players.

It's really hard to aquire more points than I did.

 

[SoggyShorts]

Maybe it's a good idea now to modify the waiting timer to make it easier for many to reach level 6, and see how that works.

Yep, change it to 12h, and reduce the total needed for 10 checkpoints by 50%, see how that goes.
If it's too easy to get too many KP, remove the 25 KP reward from checkpoint 10 as well

 

[CrazyWizard]

12 might be way to much. you get really weird tournaments then (people comming from nowhere where others are finished at thrusday), maybe 15 hours, or a small extension to the duration.

It just need to be times in such fashion that it does not require a workday.

what about prolongued timers? accomplishing the same thing?

1st timer: 9 hours?
2nd: 12 hours
3rd: 15 hours
4rth 18 hours
5th: 21 hours

resulting in: tuesday 7 Pm start
2nd round: wednesday 4-9am
3rd round: wednesday 4-9pm
4th round: thrusday 7-12 pm (shift to end workday say 6pm)
5th round: friday 9 pm
6th round saturday 6 pm (time to short for a proper 6th round)

also 4rth round is harder to autocombat than my normal 2nd at wednesday currently
So a little fiddling with these timers is in order. but something gradual like this might work much better.

Als have the tournament start at the servers local time instead german time would help a lot for the US players.

 

[SoggyShorts]

@CrazyWizard
For many people in American timezones the tournament starts after you leave for work on Tuesday.
In your example using staggered times:
If we assume someone in New York or L.A. works 9-5
Tournament starts at 9 am or noon in L.A.
1st round Tuesday Evening (activate 9h timer) 6pm
2nd round Wednesday Morning (activate 12h timer) 8am
3rd round Wednesday Evening (activate 15h timer) 8pm
4th round Thursday Evening (activate 18h timer) 6pm
5th round Friday Evening (activate 21h timer) 6pm
6th round not possible, tournament ends Sat morning/noon

I don't think they will change the start times, simply because no solution there will please everyone anyways.
I understand that you, as a #1 rank tournament player, are worried that someone will jump past you unexpectedly with very short timers, but for the other 99% of players a drop from 16h to at least 14 is very much needed.