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[DeletedUser651]

Where's the harm??

The harm is that either player A or player B will get the rune. If player B really really really needs that rune shard, but player A comes in and grabs it, then player B is harmed.

Donating to wonders adds a nice bit of competition to the game

Exactly. Competition. When we used to be a game of cooperation.

 

[DeletedUser629]

Apparently, player A needs that rune as well, and is willing to spend goods or coins on KP to get it. Player B should do the same if he/she really really needs it. it's usually only about the mountain halls. The bulwark isn't very popular, and the human/elves ones can be obtained earlier in the game when provinces aren't all that expensive to conquer.

Again, player B isn't harmed in any way, player A simply wanted it more.

 

[DeletedUser651]

Of course player B is harmed. They don't get what they want and what they have contributed a whole ton of KP towards. As you said it is competition. One person wins, the other loses. As opposed to win/win.

But whatever. It is what it is.

 

[DeletedUser629]

Not getting what you want doesn't mean you're harmed. Besides, players can still get a rune when they're not in 1st place. It has been like this since the introduction of the AW, so players had plenty of time to come up with some kind of strategy.

 

[DeletedUser651]

Besides, players can still get a rune when they're not in 1st place.

Come on, Goryn. Obviously I am speaking about when a person doesn't get a rune because they fall just out of the "money". Investing tons of KP into something and then having no rune to show for it is clearly a harm.

players had plenty of time to come up with some kind of strategy.

And as far as coming up with a strategy....sure....of course....people can learn how to harm others effectively and block out other players. That doesn't change the basic fact that Ancient Wonders are not based on cooperation, they are based on competition. You used the word competition yourself. You know what I am talking about. Sniping runes is a form of one player competing against another aka player vs player. That doesn't mean it is the same harm as FoE, but it is harm. We are speaking of a spectrum. On one end of the spectrum of pvp is the wonders, where you have to compete against another player and one wins and another loses. On the other end of the spectrum is a game like FoE where you plunder and steal goods that a player already has accumulated. But both concepts are one player wins something at the expense of the other.

Maybe we could add the ability to give rune shards away? Then I wouldn't have to be torn between helping out a fellow build a wonder at the expense of grabbing a shard from another fellow who was also helping. This by the way, is another way the AW adds a layer of loss to this game. If I don't even want the shard, I may be inadvertently sniping it away from one of my friends....or I have to choose not to help another friend build their wonder faster.

But these things are causing fights between friends and ill will and more than one player has left because they didn't like the change in dynamics. Maybe it is a gender issue. I don't know. It seems the guys don't understand how the AW rune situation can be harmful in any way shape or form, but the girls get it.

 

[DeletedUser867]

But these things are causing fights between friends and ill will and more than one player has left because they didn't like the change in dynamics.

The fights are typically caused by a misguided rotational policy that PREVENTS awards being distributed proportional to the contribution amounts.

• The KP awards are 10% of the level size, distributed amongst the top 5 contributors, apportioned 1/2, 1/4, 1/8, 1/16, 1/32 rounded DOWN to the nearest 5 KPs.
• Rune Shards are awarded one per level, distributed Round Robin amongst the top 5 contributors.
  Level 7, for example, yields 1,1,1,1,1 + 1,1 = 2,2,1,1,1 Rune Shards.

A rotational club, or ANY other procedure that prevents

• A natural competition for 1st and 2nd, at 45% + 30%, to divvy up 75% of the awards
• And a separate competition for 3rd, 4th, and 5th, at 15% + 6% + 4%, to divvy up the remaining 25% of the awards

not only flies in the face of the game mechanics, but it also invites jumping the queue, "cheating", and sniping.

Don't blame the Ancient Wonders for being unfair, if the fault lies with poor Policies.

As an example, here's a typical spread from a similar Great Building in Forge of Empires, wherein the rewards are roughly proportional to the contributions.

 

[DeletedUser408]

This game has no real alternative to get your ranks higher, unless you diamond spend, it is out of balance(diamand players will always lead the pack, which is fine, But FOE has an alternative to try and blance, you need to put time and effort), therefore some sort of system needs to be created to balance that IMO. so maybe PvE? what is that BTW, Player vs Elvenar? we are already doing that when we sector fight, and yes i know we get points for that but no where balanced to even come close to help the score that makes it worthwhile and since alot more content in tech is coming i don't due anymore provinces then i need now, Recall the lets introduce AW's 1 year into the game with many gone as far as possible in sectors so rune and shards have all been wasted as you cannot go back to collect those shards for provinces won(maybe they should have done that right, and randomly spread runes from lets say province 20 and onward so we could back collect them)
Anyways i do not consider AW a PvP type thing, there value and worth is suspect at best and many do not even plant them and those that do really struggle to get donations in as reward is pretty poor really, but i am trying them.
Unless Bulwark changes to allow to give a proportional army from the 1st type we put in queue that would be 100% better, i did not realize it actually meant the 1st type only forever, so i will always get a light melee which is kind of a useless AW, perhaps they will release 3- and now 6 more army type AW bulwarks for the other slots of army production, can you imagine the wasted space. My current Bulwark is like the Notre Dame in FOE, pretty useless i think unless they change its function to give bonus our 1st type we place in slot #1 not just melee

 

[DeletedUser213]

My Sword Acrobats became useful again when I reached Squad Size Upgrade #21. 264 in a squad makes them strong enough to take on targets they could not when a squad was smaller. I just took a province using only Swords for 7 of 8 sectors. Don't give up on the Bulwark or the Sword Acrobats just yet.

 

[DeletedUser651]

That is great news Maelchi! Thank you for the post!!

 

[Jixel]

My Sword Acrobats became useful again when I reached Squad Size Upgrade #21. 264 in a squad makes them strong enough to take on targets they could not when a squad was smaller. I just took a province using only Swords for 7 of 8 sectors. Don't give up on the Bulwark or the Sword Acrobats just yet.

Oooh, the new squad size upgrades are 24 instead of 12 ? That is great news indeed !

(I think I suggested it somewhere in a forum thread a few months back ... I'm sure they were paying attention )

 

[Preator]

Oooh, the new squad size upgrades are 24 instead of 12 ? That is great news indeed !

(I think I suggested it somewhere in a forum thread a few months back ... I'm sure they were paying attention )

No, it is not, i guess.

Squad size Upgrade #19 ==> Squad Size 240
Squad size Upgrade #21 ==> Squad Size 264

Still an increment of 12 each per upgrade. Sorry to disappoint you