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Discussion Tournament Changes (post-release)

DeletedUser724

Guest
When trying to decide if its harder or easier now, do not forget to take into account that previously 4 fights, is now 1 fight. So i don't think you can look at the base numbers and compare them, it would be better to compare your total losses/costs.

Total lost is not a loss to you and inno

there is no comparsion to a total lost in round 1
it is due to enemy squad size....
to the beginner, in past, they can learn "fighting tactic" in round 1 and 2 with their squad size is larger than enemy squad size
it is now a lesson to them, do not play tournament, do not play elvenar as it is not a game for beginner
 

DeletedUser2705

Guest
This is a problem, but for some reason I just couldn't stop laughing at it. All this talk about making it easier for players like you... It sure doesn't look easier... I just find the irony hilarious.
I find it a little funny. Why you got this laugh, I guess.
I do not see only another meaning in INNO, to reduce KP in this way. Only miracles that have already been raised, who wanted. And who did not want, he found himself in an extremely uncomfortable position.
 

DeletedUser724

Guest
LOL, more rewarding for what? Points? Because getting more such quality rewards as rune shards from 3* provinces (instead of KPs from 2*) does not feel particularly rewarding.

shhhhhhh more player buy diamond shhhhhhhhh...that is the only reward
 

edeba

Well-Known Member
I went out 43 provinces and screen shot around 33 of them. I screen shot my before and finished goods, as well as troops.

So, 29% of my troops used, 4 days of goods product and a week of orc production, all my coin and supplies, and that was the easy level. That was doing what I've done every week, and when I only did mostly just 2 levels, I was building up resources week over week.

I advocated for trust and I admit I was wrong and I have a new avatar demonstrating the lesson from the error of my beliefs.
 

Enevhar Aldarion

Well-Known Member
So I went back and read over the announcement again I do not agree with what they think is a hardcore tournament player:

As you can see, the difficulty doesn't increase until you are really far into the Tournament (roughly 5000 points' worth), which is typically reached only by the most hardcore and veteran Tournament players, for whom we intend to offer more of a challenge.

Maybe if someone does that much every week, that is the type of player they are trying to make do less, but on a couple of the weeks on Live, specifically Steel, Planks, and Crystal, I can score over that by only doing the first two stars of every province I have open, or around 65 provinces for those three. I do not think I am a hardcore player because I cannot do that in the harder tournaments, but I will get punished and lose all that KP, since I sometimes have scores similar to the hardcore players. 20 provinces to 2 stars, instead of 65, is a loss of 225 KP in those weeks. Sure, in chapter 16, that is not even enough to fill almost any of the techs, but it still hurts.
 

alexgreat

Member
I still believe we lack a clear purpose in this case. What is the real goal behind increasing tournament difficulty so dramatically? The tournament is already quite popular - most everyone plays it. This change does not help smaller players - it only makes their progress harder. This change does not help Innogames sell more diamond either. The only possible goal for increasing difficulty is to reduce the amount of rewards given by the tournament. If this is the real goal, then I have a very simple solution: just cut the rewards. It will be totally fine if we get one enchantment from every other province instead of every single province. There is no need making tournaments so difficult.
 

DeletedUser2524

Guest
I have not read this full thread but one suggestion that I thought of was this -the icon for the provinces was not easy to find this time around. Maybe it is because I am colorblind for certain shades of red and green and I am not a very observant person, but the icon you used to use stood right out. This is just a minor point - but I think it could be tweaked just a bit
 

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Jaxom

Well-Known Member
Note: earlier I posted that last week I used only 18K goods for province 16. It was 180K. So the new system is cheaper on goods but had a far higher number of orcs (7K vs 670). And troops were higher (42K vs 36K).
Sorry for the confusion.
Starting on round 2. After 5 it is still reasonable. Expect it to go crazy after 10.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
please turn it back to 4 encounters
To many idiots complained they had to many clicks now that they did 40 provinces instead of 20,
This is now completly solved, only 1 fight per province instead of 4 and no more 20+ provinces.
A double whammy for the complainers, they got what they wanted
Now now, just because inno released a tournament rebalancing on the same day as they released the combining 4 provinces into one does not mean this was one idea or suggested by any player.

The request was simple: combine 4 fights into 1, use the average and multiply costs by 4. Simple, easy, quick. and fair.
Inno for their own reasons decided on a total balance and difficulty overhaul which has nothing to do with the request to reduce clicks.

Your anger is misplaced.
 

Richord

Well-Known Member
somewhere in the beginning it was mentioned that it would get more difficult for players with 5k or more in total?
that's complete -you-know-what!
If i've massive losses for just 11provs and that I've to cater the first round..... oh inno. Do you care about us? like, .... at all?


I'd like (like in my other thread) a inno-statement that squadresearch can be done now without being afraid that we'll get trouble later on. This seems the only way atm to make the tournament less hard. Right? ( @Marindor or any of you)
 
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DeletedUser724

Guest
Now now, just because inno released a tournament rebalancing on the same day as they released the combining 4 provinces into one does not mean this was one idea or suggested by any player.

The request was simple: combine 4 fights into 1, use the average and multiply costs by 4. Simple, easy, quick. and fair.
Inno for their own reasons decided on a total balance and difficulty overhaul which has nothing to do with the request to reduce clicks.

Your anger is misplaced.

As i read previous post
voting to "reduce click", it does not mean ...reduce to 1 encounter
Inno hijack "reduce click"
you are experice player
you should aware...
the loss in 4 fight is less than lost in 1 fight, or "super less" lost in 1 fight

as I state in previous post
I use "auto fight" to gain time, auto fight...how many click, i click...just once
4 encounter, just 4 "auto fight" click
I try to avoid manual fight...TOO MANY CLICK

I do not afraid of AMOUNT OF CLICK, I afraid AMOUNT OF LOSS
we do tournament becos we are not satisify with amount of kp from daily kp and kp from event building
tournament is our main source to collect kp to feed tech tree and grow AW
without kp collected from tournament, a chapter may takes several months to years, we even need to stop growth of AW with a small amount of kp due to that change in tournament

There is no reason that Inno break statement that "squad size" help us to fight easier. Now the squad size has killed us when we reach a milestone of provinces. beginner may reach their milestone much earlier

it seems our AW level also play a important role to get our army kill easier. That is completely oppose to the idea to raise AW level. We raise AW level in order fr us to kill enemy easier or fight longer. This , now, turn out, it also raise enemy strength (like squad size, we increase, enemy increase)

There is no reason why they random soldier type. We have recruit "specific type of soldier" for each tournment, put item to increase "attack strength" or "life".......that is part of our strategy plan to handle each tournament..... this , now, fall apart

If young player do feel problem of "many click", they need to train "how to fight", more fight ( 4 encounter ) instead of a single fight ( 1 encounter). 4 encounter will give 4 lesson to correct mistakes and how to handle, it is much better than 1 fight that he lost all his army and he may even also lost his interest in playing elvenar.

If inno worry about those player who go to 100 province....etc. it is completely Inno problem. Most player do not reach that value. Player who can reach that "crazy provinces" , it is becos they have a better AW...etc. It is just a small portion of player only. Why majority player, like me, penalize with their achievement. as I say, it is Inno problem, if they think...e.g. reaching 40 provinces....is not so good in this game, they just revise their formuale, adding more enemy soldier from previous provinces after reaching province 40.... so that those crazy small protion of player do not process easily to 100 provinces.

I do not misplace anger
It is totally Inno problem,
1. squad size tech does not comply with their description that make player fight easily
2. there is no vote to combine 4 encounter into 1 , only vote for less click
3. Run "raise our AW level" that also help enemy too
4. Punish a small portion of player who can reach 100 provinces , but serious punish large portion of player who not reach 100 provinces...
5, Change enemy from a fixed pattern to various pattern such that player can no longer have any strategy plan to recuit soldier for next tournament
6. I hope Inno should aware we do not play ELvenar beta only, we have game worlds....we do not want spend too much time in a game, we need time to do game worlds.....our real-life issue...

This new change has kill our time as we are suffer total lost even in round 1....
 

Lovec Krys

Well-Known Member
Well, the reason for this is obvious: The great reward nerf
And no, it has nothing to do with multiple bears, even if everyone had only 1 bear, they would still do the same change.
And while my beta city is not affected so bad - since it has never tournament oriented and has low number of expansions and wonder levels - my live city's tournament will be slauthered:
Not only if the same or very similar formula to the Spire is used, then my live city already has 76% more expensive Spire, and now I can expect the same for Tournaments.
So not only I can forget about doing pernamently 10K+, but I can also forget about top tournament positions since the fighting has been made almost or totaly impossible for high provinces and also thanks to the formula and adding coins,supplies & mana the negotiating is also impossible for high provinces due to the costs greatly beyond production (and in case coins & supplies also due to limited stock), so mid game players with low (best no) wonder levels & minimum expansions will simply beat me due to much lesser costs.
And top of it, I'll have very hard time to maintain my relics supply for Magic Academy - the number of points in tourny needed for 24/7 MM spell in MA lv5 is around 7k points...

So thank you.

ps: How many of you can bet this goes to live with only cosmetic changes?
 

DeletedUser3289

Guest
ps: How many of you can bet this goes to live with only cosmetic changes?
I would say that would first throw boulders at us. Then they would say they listened to us and pelt us with stones. And most of us would grudgingly oblige.
probably that’s also their strategy. Hit us very hard. Then hit us with what they intend to. With our memory of the first system, we would accept it.
overall in the end, they just want to nerf the tournaments too. Not sure why!!! They really hate gamers who do well, or even enjoy their product.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
2. there is no vote to combine 4 encounter into 1 , only vote for less click
Well, there was this: https://beta.forum.elvenar.com/index.php?threads/tournaments-reduce-tournament-encounters.12885/
and iirc a similar discussion on the US forums had wide-spread support.

Just like removing the penalty for researching optional Squad size techs is a good idea by itself, reducing the encounters from 4 to 1 (like they did from 8 to 4) is a good idea by itself with very little downside. (less practice for newbs is valid)

All I'm saying is that we shouldn't combine our feedback on these into one idea.
I mean if I suggested that inno give everyone cookies, but they gave us cookies and a kick in the bikini area would you blame my cookie idea?
 

Dony

King of Bugs
1 thing which can be done without changing any numbers is that

for province 1-10 only 1* enemies can appear
for province 10-20 slow ramp up increase to 2*
for around province 20 all enemies 2*
for province 20-30 slow ramp up to increase to 3*
province 30 first province with 3* enemies

similar how it was in that bug 1 month ago

that would help ease difficulty for new players, reduces damage received, reduces loses
 

Pauly7

Well-Known Member
@Marindor one thing that a fellow brought up on Live... if the tournaments are to continue in this format, is there a plan to reduce the Fellowship Adventure requirements for spell badges and Wonder Societies? The spells, in particular will now be almost impossible to complete.
 

maxiqbert

Well-Known Member
I think it's time to show a bit of intelligence and annonce already a softer version. Something along your announcement : those 5000 points were OK to me 1380 isn't
 
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