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Trader Relics Trader/New Currency

Are you in favor of this idea?


  • Total voters
    9
  • Poll closed .

Soleil

Guest
Summary
Implement a trading functionality for Relics.

Description
Was just reading an older post about tournaments stopping for a while and lack of relics because one must wait an extended period of time before that tournament comes around again.

For someone who is trying to use the magic academy but not having relics to actually use it, is frustrating.

I would guess that players who join in a lot of tournaments might have excess relics, more than they could possibly ever use. (Screen shots please) Then there are players who are trying to use the magic academy and upgrade their wonders and run short on relics, speaking from experience.

My suggestion is to have a relics trader to trade with other players for needed relics. I like that I can craft relics in the magic academy but then I run out of another type of relics to craft the combining catalyst. Some of those relics that I need are outside of my blue map. To sit without relics and a magic academy not doing anything is counter-productive. (and makes me wonder why I upgraded it)

I can’t think of anything negative about trading relics, the magic academy is random with what you can create so getting my boosted goods to max level at chapter 2 probably wouldn’t happen. At my level, I don’t have 1000’s of relics to trade anyway. I would add a limit to who can trade, if someone is sitting on 1000’s of one type of relic they can’t accept a trade to get more of that type of relic. How trading works in this game isn’t very good. Even if someone is trying to be kind, and doesn’t really need the goods or relics (if we had a relics trader), they are taking away goods that might be truly needed by someone else.

If someone does have 1000's of every type of relic and wants to get rid of their excess, but doesn't want more of another type, maybe they can sell relics for gold, supplies or goods that they may need.

Or another suggestion is to have a new type of currency other than relics to make enchantments.

Motivation
Make it easier to obtain the relics you want.

Possible downsides
Game balance, less need for crafting certain relics, less need for strategically having to choose which relics you'd rather safe for spells etc.
 
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SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
There already is a solution though: tournaments.

Games like this thrive in part due to social interaction. Gaining relics easily from the tournament while in a fellowship is one of the biggest incentives to encourage this.
I'm sure that a company like Inno pulling in 200 million a year has done some studies that show players are more likely to stick around in the fellowship, so anything that discourages players from joining one or removes the incentive for joining one isn't going to happen.
 

Soleil

Guest
@Soggyshort, that is but one solution for me to gain relics but, if someone is sitting on 6300 relics of one kind what in the world would they ever spend that amount of relics on?

And then keep increasing these numbers because of tournaments.

The newest ancient wonders don’t even use relics as far as I can tell. Prior to that, the most any wonder took to upgrade is 13 relics. The lighthouse of Good Neighborhood takes less than 250 relics of one kind to upgrade to level 30. There isn’t room in our cities for more wonders that would use up all of these relics.

My solution was to trade those 6300 for other relics one might need or for other supplies/goods/seeds etc. Joining a fellowship doesn’t solve the issue of excess relics fellowship members have.

If joining a fellowship was required, I wouldn’t have the option to not be in one.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
That player with 6300 relics can safely be ignored. They have chosen to not progress in the tech Tech tree for well over a year. In fact they have said they will do continue to do so for another 4 years.
Also they exclusively make 1 type of spell, therefore not using the relics evenly, on top of being a #1 tournament player.
The developers do not need the Institute any new feature just for them.

I am not totally against giving us something else to spend relics on, but I think trading is a very problematic idea. Players would be able to max out boosts 3x as fast, or if there was something to prevent that, then why bother?
 

Soleil

Guest
I’m not sure I would ignore anyone’s concern, that’s why we’re here on this forum.

I sincerely hope there isn’t something new that uses relics, they are an over-used currency already. I think I saw that they are now in FA, which makes sense since it’s fs members who have the excess.

If the concern is that a lower chapter would have max boosts, what would it hurt?

There really isn’t a way I would gain max boost at chapter 2, I don’t have enough relics to trade. And I don’t want to put myself in a position where I lack relics for things other than my boosted goods. Because the relics I would trade right now wouldn’t all be for my boosted goods but to make combining catalysts, preparing for ancient wonder upgrades and maybe enough for a future event if you have to make something in the magic academy.
 
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edeba

Well-Known Member
Sheesh, when you talk about me you could at least get your facts straight. Not true that I haven't progressed in the tech tree for over a year. The 6300 relics are on live, not beta and I have all of the beneficial alumi building and that came out what, 6-8 months ago?

I have said that I will not continue without the ability to upgrade my event buildings and I estimated 4 years with their first drafts of their plans. I've already upgrade my signature to a year now, but that's without having had time to think through, plan or see how it works out in the game.

The tournament is a strong driver of the game and anyone who spends money on this game has no need for crafting the rest of the spells. You get at least double the supplies and you get a uneven amount of spells from the tournament, with lots to increase supplies and few to increase goods. Making the MM spell is a feature of a strong tournament playing player who has enhanced their game with diamonds. The magic residences and workshops are highly beneficial and cost effective enhancements to the game.

Have just one polished workshop and you save 2 expansions for reduced need for extra workshops, welll, at least at the 6x4 size. It is simply the most cost effective way to enhance your game if you have purchased the first 2-3 expansions.

You are nuts to suggest that I am alone in how I play and that players like me should be ignored.

That canceling of the dust tournament on beta hurt every gems boosted player in my beta f/s and my beta f/s is also strong players. We've all had our MA shut down for want of MM and CC spells that can't be made because we did not get the dust relics we needed. Further, I was low on dust relics because of life events also happened around dust tournaments. The scrolls had the same demand before the CC and I have well over 1000 more of them so when I went back to think about what had prevented me from getting them, well, my sister was dying and then she died. So I got to spend one last vacation with her, and then I got to watch her die and that's why I was short of dust relics in the first place. I had equal demand for scroll relics, but to have missed that tournament would not have shut down my MA. But then, the main reason I started to play this game was to just block real life in first place, not think about hard realities spinning beyond my control...

And, I make two kinds of spells now, MM and CC, and they are both highly dependent on the same relic, T3+2, although the CC uses 1/3rd less.

That player with 6300 relics can safely be ignored. They have chosen to not progress in the tech Tech tree for well over a year. In fact they have said they will do continue to do so for another 4 years.
Also they exclusively make 1 type of spell, therefore not using the relics evenly, on top of being a #1 tournament player.
The developers do not need the Institute any new feature just for them.

I am not totally against giving us something else to spend relics on, but I think trading is a very problematic idea. Players would be able to max out boosts 3x as fast, or if there was something to prevent that, then why bother?
 
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Soleil

Guest
@edeba I am truly sorry to hear of your sister’s passing. Having had a recent loss myself, my heart goes out to you and your loved ones.

We are given an opportunity to make things less frustrating in the game, Edeba had her frustrations and they were warranted, no matter how one plays. It’s their game and their money.

When I originally started playing, I bought magic houses and workshops but then had no way to upgrade them. My points were too low for the fellowships that got the blueprints in the tournament, so they sat and ended up being worse for me than regular residences and I deleted them. Now I buy diamonds when they do something positive to the game. The crafting is new and I liked it and they have improved it, I bought diamonds. I’ll save those up and maybe buy an expansion.

But now I lack relics to use it a little more. I don’t have to have it running 24/7 but a few extra goodies to craft would be nice. If I had spare relics, that would help a player like Edeba, I would trade in a heartbeat. There is beauty in not being in a fellowship, you aren’t limited by who you want to help or feel like you’re not being loyal to a fellowship by helping others.

I won’t always lack relics, once I start my trek to chapter 3 I’ll again have more relics.

Edeba, what are your thoughts on trading relics? Whether it’s real life that steps in or hiccups in the game, would you be opposed to this and/or have reservations about it?
 

edeba

Well-Known Member
It would have been nice to have an option to make up for the problem, especially when there is a such a massive imbalance depending on how a player plays and what happens in the game.

Edeba, what are your thoughts on trading relics? Whether it’s real life that steps in or hiccups in the game, would you be opposed to this and/or have reservations about it?
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
@edeba oh was that you?:eek:

I'm sorry to hear about your RL loss, but you must admit that it's hard for the devs to predict a combination of
A personal loss that prevented your play
A suspension of tournament for 1 week

You(and I suppose others) play at the very edge of the game, where a pretty minor thing like missing a tournament for 1 week can throw off your game for months.
maybe I'm wrong but that doesn't seem like a problem that affected alarge portion of the player base, and even if it is it's not one likely to repeat.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
If the concern is that a lower chapter would have max boosts, what would it hurt?
Balance.
The cost of techs and building upgrades from chapters 1 through 6 are based on assumption that a player will have x% boost.
If you are allowed to trade relics from the 6 non boosted tournaments for your 3 boosted, then your boost would more than double, effectively cutting costs in half.
Selling relics to other players would be even more disastrous to the balance.
This drastic a change in the early chapters would have many negative effects. One of which being the feeling that the following chapters are extremely difficult when in fact they aren't, they only seem to be so by comparison.
another would be the further widening of the gap between players who play in a fellowship and players who for some reason choose to play solo.
 

Soleil

Guest
@SoggyShorts

If someone is effectively cutting costs, how is that disastrous? Seems kinda smart to me.

Why is it okay for a person in a fellowship to have max boosts before chapter 6 but not someone without a fellowship? Some of this I think you’re just making up and being an alarmist.

Personally, I think trading relics would even out the balance that fellowships members have with relics. Right now, fellowships who participate in fellowship adventures and in some paths are literally throwing away their excess relics.
 

edeba

Well-Known Member
It shut down the MA for 3 players in my beta FA, so that is in the range of 1/3rd of our gem producers.

Seems to me that when I presented that getting all the chests had become so much easier you presented that was a fairly large group of players. I maintain that gem producers in this group were all adversely affected on the use of their MA by the cancelled tournament.

You(and I suppose others) play at the very edge of the game, where a pretty minor thing like missing a tournament for 1 week can throw off your game for months.
maybe I'm wrong but that doesn't seem like a problem that affected alarge portion of the player base, and even if it is it's not one likely to repeat.
 

Lovec Krys

Well-Known Member
@SoggyShorts So is the difference between players with and without tournament. Players with tournament get to the max. bonuses much faster. I don't see a problem with players reaching max bonus a little earlier due to trading relics.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
@SoggyShorts So is the difference between players with and without tournament. Players with tournament get to the max. bonuses much faster. I don't see a problem with players reaching max bonus a little earlier due to trading relics.
I have enough spare boosted relics to get a few players from zero to max. Assuming a limit of 1:1 trades, they can still max boosts at TRIPLE the rate.
That is not "a little sooner"
 

shadowblack

Well-Known Member
I have enough spare boosted relics to get a few players from zero to max. Assuming a limit of 1:1 trades, they can still max boosts at TRIPLE the rate.
That is not "a little sooner"
Oh, really? And where are those players going to get the Relics to trade with you?

In the early chapters Relics are very limited, especially if the player is not in an FS that gets a lot of chests in the tournament. That greatly limits the potential trading of Reics players in the early chapters can do. And with the low production of early manufactories the difference between (for example) 600% and 700% boost really isn't that great. I honestly don't see the problem with getting a few more players to max boost in Dwarves or Fairies instead of in Orcs or Woodelves.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
Oh, really? And where are those players going to get the Relics to trade with you?
.
From their non+boosted tournaments
I thought that was obvious.
3/9 tournaments are boosted, bur if you can trade relics, then 9/9 give you relics for your boost.

Edit: maybe making the game even easier isn't a big deal, I dunno...
They added timer instants, portal profits, buffed wonders FS tournaments and all kinds of event buildings and features...and yet many suggestions seem to be for making something about the game even easier. Perhaps that is just what players want.
I know I'm biased and like a certain degree of challenge, but maybe I'm in the minority.
 
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shadowblack

Well-Known Member
From their non+boosted tournaments
I thought that was obvious.
3/9 tournaments are boosted, bur if you can trade relics, then 9/9 give you relics for your boost.

Edit: maybe making the game even easier isn't a big deal, I dunno...
They added timer instants, portal profits, buffed wonders FS tournaments and all kinds of event buildings and features...and yet many suggestions seem to be for making something about the game even easier. Perhaps that is just what players want.
I know I'm biased and like a certain degree of challenge, but maybe I'm in the minority.
Let's look at a chapter V player who just started the chapter. 75 completed provinces (the minimum required) * 8 encounters per province = 600 Relics divided among the 9 types. Only about a third of them are your 3 boosted types, leaving you with less than 100 relics per boost and ~400 non-boosted relics from provinces. Even if you were to trade all 400 for one of your boosted types, that would barely be enough to max one boost. You'll have to get the remaining 800+ relics from other sources, mainly tournaments. At that time the player has very few tournament provinces per type, limiting the amount of relics that can be obtained in this manner.

It's even worse in the earlier chapters (Chapter IV required 50 provinces, so just 400 Relics from encounters). Then there's the fact that the player needs to keep at least some non-boosted relics for upgrading AWs, as well as enough relics for making enchantments in the MA. So it's not quite as simple as you seem to think - even if you have the relics to trade the other player likely does not.

As for making the game easier: Well, maybe that's the goal - to make it easier to reach the Sentient Goods chapters as a way to combat the disbalance in some goods. Moonstone and Obsidian seem in very high demand at the start of the Constructs chapter, leaving some players stuck due to a lot of demand and not enough supply.
 

Karvest

Well-Known Member
Even 50 provinces give you 5+ tournament provinces, if you close all 6 stars for them, you get 65+ relics (without FS bonus, that can be up to 20 for 10chest FS (and don't tell me that there are no tourney active FS that can take chapter 4 player. I was in chapter 4 when I joined current FS, it was not 10chest FS at that time, but we took 7 chests without problems, and even after we became 10chest FS we still have newcomers from early chapters).
I got my full boost in dwarves or early fairies without relics trade and overscooting, if relics trading would be a thing - I'd got it way earlier.
 

Syonis

Well-Known Member
One year ago a new server started where i began to play. So now ressource boost from others what so ever and it took me 18 weeks (2 tournament cycles) to become full boosted (500+ Relics for t1-t3 boosts). Even if you take double the time it`s still faster than in was intended by Inno.