• Dear forum reader,

    To actively participate on the forum by joining discussions or starting your own threads or topics, you need a game account and to REGISTER HERE!

Discussion Release Notes version 1.54

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
Arbor of Spring Flowers
8.png
culture.png
210
culture.png
-19

Why? Was the game balance totally borked because of those 19 culture points?

Rainbow Flower Cage
8.png
population.png
117
culture.png
117
population.png
-47
culture.png
-47
9.png
population.png
132
culture.png
132
population.png
0
culture.png
0
Really? Orcs already has the crappiest event prizes, and now the gap gets even wider?
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
Glossy Garden

8.png
population.png
1760
culture.png
1760
population.png
-710
culture.png
-710

9.png
population.png
1990
culture.png
1990
population.png
0
culture.png
0
This building used to have a nice easy curve, and now there's near 100% jump?

Father Tree of Candy Canes

8.png
population.png
1100
culture.png
1100
population.png
-290
culture.png
-920

9.png
population.png
1350
culture.png
135
population.png
+190
culture.png
-1010
Again, the worst chapter to be in for an event has always been orcs, and you are trashing another one of the few decent orc level buildings.

I've never been part of the "inno is just making a money grab" crowd, but it really looks like you are screwing over chapter 8 players so that they use the upcoming diamond upgrade feature just to get back where they should have been.
It's like when a store raises prices by 50% just so they can have a 30% off sale.

Note: All of my cities are way past orcs, and I don't actually have any of these buildings. I have however read ever single post regarding event prizes on US and Beta since I started.
 
Last edited:

Calenmir

Well-Known Member
My best guess is that the current re-balance is going to prove sufficiently painful to make me overly sad. I think it's going to be terribly unpopular on live, and going to lead to the kind of histrionics that lead to threats and rage-quitting.

We've had to make decisions since the first event about which buildings to keep, and which to discard. I've thrown out Blue tree enclosures from the winter event because my glossy gardens from a year ago were both more attractive and more functional. Now the developers have made a decision that will change this. I do not, however, have any-way to change my decision. The feeling of fairness is an important part of player retention. This does not feel fair, which is a bit of an issue

I sincerely hope you revisit the amount of the adjustments. perhaps they could be broken into smaller increments over the next couple of updates, or players could receive one upgrade spell for each event building they have deployed from a previous event, or just auto-upgrade buildings from the past to 1 chapter below where the player is currently. I think it is probably worthwhile to make some effort to ward off the fallout of this decision.

Yes to all of it, but they also said this "Soon, you will also already be able to upgrade your event buildings as a premium option" followed by "However, we are in the final stage of preparing a feature that will offer this option without the use of diamonds as well, by using a new kind of spell, which will replace your Blueprints."

Until they offer that spell, the only way to recoup is to buy so WHEN is that spell going to be available? I'm not asking you, of course, just generally - how long are we supposed to wait for that spell? You mention that perhaps they could provide a spell and that would be great - but if that spell is a long way off, folks are left with limited choices. They could buy the upgrade, or buy additional space to put up more culture or houses (or whatever they've run out of but currently don't have space to put up) or they dump the buildings and put up the new ones. Offering an alternative 'down the road' really sucks because it does nothing for them when they wake up to find they have lost both pop and culture and have to rethink all plans for their city. Would it have killed them to put the spell out first before this change? Like they did with blueprints. Made them available in advance of the actual need (as I recall - I think I'm remembering that correctly)? So that this won't cause such an uproar?

I'm in the process of warning all my FSs on live and telling them to visit Elven Architect and prepare or start making arrangements to keep their cities running. Hopefully this won't turn out like the changes to the AWs which really messed a lot of people up.
 

DeletedUser1163

Guest
I hope I don't lose more members in my fellowship because of this. We lost a lot of members when the new battle system was implemented. If players who spent diamonds on premium and/or event buildings find out those buildings have changed, they're going to feel cheated. Inno should refund them a portion of the diamonds they spent purchasing buildings that are now worth less in culture and population.

I think I'll have a margarita before I take a look and see what damage, if any, was done to my city because of this change. I’ve never played a game before where the mechanics of the game are changed every few years for better or worse. I just hope this change was for the better.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
I hope I don't lose more members in my fellowship because of this. We lost a lot of members when the new battle system was implemented.
To be fair, the old system was totally broken. Sure, having invincible units was fun, but very very broken.
. I’ve never played a game before where the mechanics of the game are changed every few years for better or worse.
Funny, I've never played an online game that didn't rebalance things as it grew and progressed. Please point me in the direction of the games you have played that were perfectly balanced when they were released, and never required any tweaking afterwards regardless of expansions or new content.;)
 
Last edited:

Buttrflwr

Well-Known Member
Wow, and suddenly, I am at NEGATIVE 2099 population. REALLY @Marindor? What am I supposed to do with this? I slogged thru the battle system re-design. I have hung in through thick and thin with you guys through some major re-vamping. I play live and beta, I spend money on this game. But this is ridiculous. Orcs is freaking bad enough without nerfing the only decent bldgs it had. Sigh. I have been on the verge of giving up for a while now. I am so much closer now. I have finished halflings on live, I am stuck in orc hell on beta. It is really just not as fun anymore. Maybe I should take a break, and just let my 2099 population sit there awhile. I just don't have the energy to try to figure out WHERE I am going to make up that kind of pop. SMH.
 

Calenmir

Well-Known Member
I hope I don't lose more members in my fellowship because of this. We lost a lot of members when the new battle system was implemented. If players who spent diamonds on premium and/or event buildings find out those buildings have changed, they're going to feel cheated. Inno should refund them a portion of the diamonds they spent purchasing buildings that are now worth less in culture and population.

I think I'll have a margarita before I take a look and see what damage, if any, was done to my city because of this change. I’ve never played a game before where the mechanics of the game are changed every few years for better or worse. I just hope this change was for the better.
lol - I just finally bit the bullet and looked. My culture seems to be alright, but I'm down to 43 population. I can only say at this point that at least it's not the negative others are experiencing. This truly sucks. You work hard to move forward, play hard when time allows, accept the changes - with a bit of grousing (because your only other choice is to quit), sometimes the changes are better (like this last event with reasonable choices on the quests). Then when you are all happy and thinking things are good, they slap crap like this into the game - and not for the first time. And try to make it sound like they are giving you something good 'guess what, we're going to make it possible for you to upgrade your event buildings, but because we are doing this nice thing for you we are now going to penalize you...'
 

Marindor

Well-Known Member
Hi guys,

Thank you once again for your feedback. We totally understand the feeling you have when the rebalancing meant that your population has dropped and of course, for us as well, it's not the nicest news to bring. However, please understand that we did have to make a choice here: Either discard the entire possibility to make event buildings upgradeable, or face the fact that the older event buildings needed these changes to prepare them for being upgradeable in the long run without seriously disrupting the game balance. Since it has been a huge request of our players to make blueprints work on event buildings, we decided to go with the option to prepare these older event buildings for that, even if it means taking a bitter pill on the short term. As some players already mentioned in this thread: Elvenar is still a young game with many planned years to come and unfortunately not all balancing has been perfect right from the start. This means that when we make changes in mechanics, like making buildings upgradeable which were originally never meant to be upgradeable, we have to polish these kind of things sometimes. We do hope you understand this and are able to look beyond the short term disappointment and see the benefit on the long term of being able to upgrade these buildings to all the levels/chapters that are still to come. For me, personally, I think it would be a shame if the upgrade possibility would be turned back because of too much negative feedback that's based on short-term vision.

For some of your other questions, like when exactly the Restoration Spells (that's what they'll be called) will appear in the game and whether or not there will be other ways to gain them than just tournaments: At this moment I don't have any details on this yet. I know that we're in the last stage of testing and polishing before implementing them, but we don't have an exact estimate yet. Of course we strive to implement them as soon as possible, so you will be able to get these event buildings to higher levels to increase their bonuses again to a standard which matches the current chapters you are in.
 

DeletedUser1163

Guest
Why would you want to upgrade event buildings? Most players delete them after awhile. We have a limited amount of space in our cities. The buildings in the higher chapters are so huge that I will have to delete a lot of event buildings in order to make room for those buildings.

Everyone in my fellowship is up in arms about this rebalancing of population and culture. One of our members found her city dropped from about 5000 to 2589. That’s 3000 less than she had before.

I don’t understand why the game devs feel they need to do this. It really hurts the higher-level players because they need much more population to construct buildings. This game is being ruined by these shenanigans.
 

DeletedUser118

Guest
As Marindor said, ppl already asked for quite a while to get an opportunity to upgrade their event buildings through blueprints. It would finaly give non-premium players a possibility to use their blueprints on something useful even for them.

This topic has been mentioned many times in here.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
I think it would be a shame if the upgrade possibility would be turned back because of too much negative feedback that's based on short-term vision.
I probably should say nothing more for fear of this, but I really think the orc level nerfs are a mistake.
Based on everything I have read, orcs is not a very popular chapter. Even for the community based building I think chapter 8 got the fewest votes (can't seem to find the poll ATM)

It's also an even bigger drop in progress speed for most players than the first guest race.
There is just way too big a swing in chapter speed from fast&easy fairies to slow&grindy orcs. They sped up woodelves considerably with the introduction of awesome mana buildings every event, but orcs gets no love. worse than that it gets the heaviest nerf of all the chapters. That doesn't make sense to me.

I have no way of knowing how many players lose interest in each chapter, but if I had to guess, I'd say orcs is probably a big one, so making it even slower by nerfing efficient buildings in chapter 8 may be a mistake.

Even before this change, my recommendation to players in chapter 8 has been to spend all event currency on instants and military temp buildings because of what I see as unbalanced rewards. This nerf will certainly do nothing to change my advice (unless they have a bunch of Restoration Spells in the bank)

Really the worst part about all of this is how much love Inno would have gotten if they didn't couple the announcement of giving us event upgrades with these nerfs. They always seem to do this.
Remember when almost every single wonder got a massive buff, but the only thing anyone talked about was having negative pop from the GA? That was done for balance too, but would giving the GA 200 more pop at the early levels have broken the game? And now, would not taking 20% off from chapter 8 rewards bork everything?
 
Last edited:

Deleted User - 62044

Guest
in the last events the prizes are very bad, in the live server we have reached the strike, leaving to play in protest.

the solution I suppose instead of improving the prizes has been to make the old ones worse so the new ones that they offer seem better compared.

the fact of expanding the buildings is a joke, if you do not know how much a building is going to give you, it will be difficult for me to participate in an event to win it. I see the end of the events since the prizes will not only be bad but also a lottery.
 

DeletedUser2410

Guest
Actually, people asked to make blueprints usable for non-diamond players - upgrading event buildings was just one of the suggestions made. But for sure there were more suggestions out there, less disrupting for the game - like, for example, buying magic buildings with an amount of blueprints?

People also asked to make blueprints visible, so I guess that's why they had to turn them into spells, among other reasons, so we can see them in our inventory.
 

Karvest

Well-Known Member
BTW, I'd like to upgrade my trees of candy canes earlier, but see no reason to do it now. There is no descent candidates for upgrade left in towns, all good buildings got nerfed, only those which were so bad that literally no one have them, was left as is or even improved to the level much better than nerfed ones. So even after upgrades would become a thing, my blueprints would still stay in inventory as scrolls, waiting for some grand prize that wouldn't be so bad...
 

DeletedUser2410

Guest
BTW, I'd like to upgrade my trees of candy canes earlier, but see no reason to do it now. There is no descent candidates for upgrade left in towns, all good buildings got nerfed, only those which were so bad that literally no one have them, was left as is or even improved to the level much better than nerfed ones. So even after upgrades would become a thing, my blueprints would still stay in inventory as scrolls, waiting for some grand prize that wouldn't be so bad...
At least then you will be able to see how many you have and not use XD
 

DeletedUser

Guest
For some of your other questions, like when exactly the Restoration Spells (that's what they'll be called) will appear in the game and whether or not there will be other ways to gain them than just tournaments: At this moment I don't have any details on this yet. I know that we're in the last stage of testing and polishing before implementing them, but we don't have an exact estimate yet. Of course we strive to implement them as soom as possible, so you will be able to get these event buildings to higher levels to increase their bonuses again to a standard which matches the current chapters you are in.

So if I understand this correctly, the Restoration Spells can not be made in the Magic Academy?
If that is so, isn't it about time to make it possible to demolish that completely useless building? Looks to me that the devs have abandoned any further uses for it :mad:
 

DeletedUser1777

Guest
Well, this change is something a lot of players won't like. Again the players will be slowed down and some more fun in this game has gone.
I understand why Inno does this balancing act, @Marindor 's explanation is quite clear about it.

But why aren't you able to hold this value change in buildings back until the option to upgrade buildings is ready to use as well? I don't believe, it would have taken any harm in your developing process to hold it back.

If you would like to have feedback about concrete problems players might see - you simply could give us the planned tweaks in advance. There are enough clever players who are able to give a proper feedback without standing in front of accomplished facts.

There is no need to be offended by negative population over night, psychologically Inno has still a lot to learn. If you dare to launch now a FA, you will create a bigger upset as you already expect by this change.
 

Dony

King of Bugs
If you would like to have feedback about concrete problems players might see - you simply could give us the planned tweaks in advance. There are enough clever players who are able to give a proper feedback without standing in front of accomplished facts.
isnt that exactly what they did? :) we are in beta after all, there is a chance this new values wont come live next week, but a bit later
 

DeletedUser

Guest
If you would like to have feedback about concrete problems players might see - you simply could give us the planned tweaks in advance. There are enough clever players who are able to give a proper feedback without standing in front of accomplished facts.

There is no need to be offended by negative population over night, psychologically Inno has still a lot to learn. If you dare to launch now a FA, you will create a bigger upset as you already expect by this change.

My biggest concern is that it is not clear yet when and especially how you can get those restoration spells. They will replace the blueprints, so if you can only win those spells in chest 10 tournaments, you will never ever be able to get enough spells to do the damage control on your affected event buildings. With the best of luck and in an top FS you will only get 1 spell per week. If you want to upgrade an eventbuilding 3 levels you have to do at least 3 tournaments with everything you've got. If you have some magic buildings, who also need those new spells, you'll also need to save up those spells for the next chapter.

Sure you can upgrade everything with diamonds, but I really dislike this strategy of InnoGames when they say this change is by requests of the players, while it's actually about pushing players into buying more and more diamonds just to keep up with the changes :(
 
Top