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Knowledge Sharing Fellowship Perks

maxiqbert

Well-Known Member
I don't understand where/how you get +46% troops production.
to increase prod speed, you need to up :
- needles (35 levels, +112% speed for 1/3 of the production)
- victory springs (35 levels, +112% speed for 1/3 of the production)
- flying academy (35 levels, +112% speed for 1/3 of the production)
- simia (35 levels, +46% speed overall)
thus making it +209.5% speed

for 140 levels of AW and (15+1.5+20+2+16+2+30+2.5)/25=88/25=3,5 extensions
(and a bunch of armouries or dwarven bulwark and or shrine of shrooms, for other extensions and other AW levels)

let's say you go for all out armouries, it takes at least 8 to have an >8h production file with 100% production (yes, it's a lot, without shrooms or dwarven bulwark).
with +112% speed (not affected by simia, obviously), you need 17 armouries, thus using up +9 extensions just for the armouries and somewhere close to it for pop and culture, so +18 extensions

So, for +209.5% speed
you use up 140 levels of AW and 20.5 extensions. I'm unable to give a proper estimation for the penalty it causes, though, because the formula isn't that clean.
My best estimation is +20% squad size, which isn't that bad.
 

edeba

Well-Known Member
153 is larger than 105, so this is, by definition, not regressive. Costly, yes, but not regressive.
By the time you do 153 levels the benefits of the faster military production speed are as if you had no AW levels, and every AW level after that your military production speed is effectively lower than if you had no AW levels. You want no cool down time for the tournament, you are up to 135 with the timewarp, and this is mostly a convenience AW. The sentient goods benefit is a decaying benefit so it is only increasing the cap of what you can store before decay = benefit. You need a bigger troop queue for the military buildings, because without a troop queue size AW you will never get the benefit of the faster speed, well, it doesn't take long to be worse off in just troop production speed. Unless your city is nothing but armories, I doubt that you could even cash in on the production benefit without the increasing troop queue AWs.
 

edeba

Well-Known Member
I don't understand where/how you get +46% troops production.
to increase prod speed, you need to up :
- needles (35 levels, +112% speed for 1/3 of the production)
- victory springs (35 levels, +112% speed for 1/3 of the production)
- flying academy (35 levels, +112% speed for 1/3 of the production)
- simia (35 levels, +46% speed overall)
thus making it +209.5% speed

for 140 levels of AW and (15+1.5+20+2+16+2+30+2.5)/25=88/25=3,5 extensions
(and a bunch of armouries or dwarven bulwark and or shrine of shrooms, for other extensions and other AW levels)

let's say you go for all out armouries, it takes at least 8 to have an >8h production file with 100% production (yes, it's a lot, without shrooms or dwarven bulwark).
with +112% speed (not affected by simia, obviously), you need 17 armouries, thus using up +9 extensions just for the armouries and somewhere close to it for pop and culture, so +18 extensions

So, for +209.5% speed
you use up 140 levels of AW and 20.5 extensions. I'm unable to give a proper estimation for the penalty it causes, though, because the formula isn't that clean.
My best estimation is +20% squad size, which isn't that bad.
I don't know what I did, but I did not get the needles, victory or flying academy speed benefits correct. I like how you counted the space.

Whenever I've compared a squad size to what your formula actually says it is within 1%, which is good enough for looking at this. So I got that your squad size would increase by 73-75% with the AW levels and land requirements, so clearly with those 4 AWs you have a significant increase in military output.

Now add the timewarp (level 30) for convenience and now the squad size is 88% bigger. Add the golden abyss (level 30) for population and now it is 105% bigger. You probably need the prosperity tower for enough supplies (level 30), so now 118%.

If you want increased military strength you have martial monastery, hero's forge, Dragon Abby, temple of the toads to add, at level 30 another 120 levels and 4 more expansions for 174% increase in squad size, but your military is stronger.

Not much else will help your tournament and spire and everything you do from here weakens your game.

Add 3 more level 30 AW and the speed benefit is gone because your squad size is now 217% bigger.

My sense was and remains that the combined expansion and AW hit should max out at about 200% bigger (300% of minimum) squad size than a person with just the free expansions and no AWs and right now it is about 500% bigger (600% of minimum). Taking the square root of the AW penalty tends to do that and going for a few selective AW that help the most is no longer the only strategy and people who have been the financial backers of this game are no longer at disadvantage for doing so.
 

Killy

Well-Known Member
@edeba You lost me somewhere in your numbers. If I remember correctly, the raise from 0 to 333 AW levels would double the cost. I don't quite see how you get to 217% in the end, might this be a mistake and it is 217% total in the end (increase of 117%)?

I just build my timewarp from 0 and finished 2 weeks ago. I placed the polar bear in addition to it and thanks to the double use of boosters, I have at least additional 50% hp for my troops. That is already better than the martial monastery + whatever extra other boost I might use (I still figure out what to do with that power). In addition I am now able to play round 6 if I want. I try to say, that convenience might be understated.^^
 

edeba

Well-Known Member
@Killy I just used the formula but I also added the space cost of the AW. You lose something else for the AW otherwise.
 

Killy

Well-Known Member
@edeba What are the numbers for your expansions? The extra cost for those are higly depend on the number of expansions you already have, therefore there isn't really a generalized argument to be made. Furthermore the golden abyss for example saves space (again how much depends on the rest of your city). Same for the martial monastery.
 

Alcaro

Well-Known Member
I think so, on live we have it on lvl 5 soon and everything works as intended. I use net0 and have no problems with the perk.
On what live server do you play and have already the Perks??? I play on En2 server and we don't have Perks yet and usually En and De servers are the guinea pigs after Beta.
 

FieryArien

Well-Known Member
Yup, it’s been live on DE servers for some time now. I was pretty surprised how soon after beta we got it. Until I realized that it’s not a global launch.
 

edeba

Well-Known Member
They just give the En server the garbage early, like the regressive tournament, and hold back on stuff you might actually like...
 

Killy

Well-Known Member
yep, german servers.

So, how do you distribute those points in a way that does not mess up net0?

In my case it is pretty boring. In the one FS we do 19 chest and gold spire every week so we only level the Knowledge Sharing perk and that's it basically. In my other FS we were doing gold spire every other week and decided to put a point in the spire archive. Since then everyone seems so motivated for the spire and we did gold every week and haven't used the archive (but hey, nothing to complain there^^).

For net0 I have a partner to exchange the kps from the perk. We chose a wonder that we don't plan to build too soon, fill the first chest and put the extra kps on top of it every day. It is almost no work this way and a easy solution imo.
 

Bor de Wolf 1965

Well-Known Member
I have 1 problem with the neighbourly help part of this new system.
That I can't use the perks I have no trouble with but as I can not give any help to the members of the FS I am in now for 24h is strange.
It makes me feel like an AH that can receive help but doesn't give any in return.
This is not good.
 

salandrine

Well-Known Member
I have 1 problem with the neighbourly help part of this new system.
That I can't use the perks I have no trouble with but as I can not give any help to the members of the FS I am in now for 24h is strange.
It makes me feel like an AH that can receive help but doesn't give any in return.
This is not good.
This is to avoid FS to change their members on a daily base just only to get the Points for perks.

Otherwise it could happen, that a player is joining a FS only for giving neigborhood help and afterwards leave this FS to make room for the next one to join and give neighorhood help again.
 

Bor de Wolf 1965

Well-Known Member
It should be made a little bit different, You can join any FS you want and give help to the members but your help doesn't count for the perk the first 24h and you can't use the FS perks they already have.
That way you can behave like a decent new member and are not misusing the FS perk system.
 

The Fairy

Well-Known Member
It makes me feel like an AH that can receive help but doesn't give any in return

Existing members can't help new members either the first 24 hours, so no need to feel like that!

And good luck getting it changed, I tried getting the tourney and spire cooldown changed, so far with no luck, as they bother me a lot more than the visits cooldown.
 

edeba

Well-Known Member
It should be made a little bit different, You can join any FS you want and give help to the members but your help doesn't count for the perk the first 24h and you can't use the FS perks they already have.
That way you can behave like a decent new member and are not misusing the FS perk system.
That would have been a better way to set it up and still avoid perk experience point abuse.
 

salandrine

Well-Known Member
You should have in mind, that every check has to be requested to the servers and expires the dataload.

Its only for 24 h, and how often is anyone changing the FS? its not often enough to change the behavior.
 
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