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Other Enticing players to return

Discussion in 'Ideas and Suggestions' started by Hugs, Jun 11, 2019.

  1. Hugs

    Hugs Active Member

    Feb 8, 2017
    When I started out playing Elevnar, I thought it was a very nice game, but ... - I had to wait a lot, so I created more cities.
    It was nice and fun for quite some time, and my cities grew bigger... until ... it felt like an uninspiring heavy burden and a thief of time.
    So I stopped playing for a week or two, maybe even more.
    The Elvenar Team sent me mails tempting me to return, and offered me gifts of diamonds...
    I would maybe return temporarily - for the diamonds, but... - would leave again after a bit of time. My cities grew bigger - and then came a new "idea" from Elvenar - needed currency that is destroyed over time. Mana and Magic Seeds, and later on those special goods you can produce.
    It is probably a good idea, and it probably help people to come back more regularly - because otherwise you loose so much.

    But, just this - you loose so much if you do not log on had a very huge impact on my inspiration to return. If I had already been away for a week or so, I could only imagine how much mana or seeds I had lost during that time, and the feeling of having to start over again to gather this stuff, that would normally take you a week anyway to get what you needed for the next research - kept me away from logging in again.

    So - what is inspiring, what would make me enticed to return to the game, like a child who is starting to dream about something nice that is going to happen soon?
    The inspiring thing with the game is to be able to do something, maybe be able to get a new building, upgrade a building, do some research, get some goods. Like, my people had been doing something when I was away. Ofc. not so much as if I had been there and inspired them, but something.

    So, this is what I suggest:
    After I have not logged on for 24 hours, my account will turn over to "Auto" mode.
    In "Auto mode"
    • of the knowledge points I earn, I will get 1 each day. With the remaining knowledge points, each hour - a random city with an ancient wonder(not mine) will be selected and the knowledge point will be dropped in that ancient wonder. This way another player can get a small benefit from me even though I did not know that player before.
    • There will be a setting you can do in your main hall - choosing between 8 different times during day and night, and at that time the folks in my city will go out and giving neighbour help to all the neighbours and brotherhood members I know, prioritizing builder first, then culture and as last resort the main hall. My neighbours get the full benefit, while I get a small percentage (1-10%?) of the normal "reward"
    • Each week I will recieve 1 relic of the type I have least of at the time
    • Each week I will recieve a number of formula fragments equal to the level of my main hall
    • My building that are producing goods of some kind will start up producing goods (and mana and seeds) at a fairly reduced rate (suggestion is 10% of nominell production)
    With this, when I choose to log on again, it will be a nice surprising experience, as I will manage to do stuff, get a little bit further, and my friends and neighbours will not be annoyed with me for being away. At the same time, what I have recieved in "Auto mode" is quite a bit less than what I would have had if I had been more active... - but, the inspiring feeling of playing when I come back will help me return.

    The downside might be that active players feel cheated by the idea that others get what they work hard for - for free... - it is therefore good to balance so you do not get a lot, and maybe it will be possible for all players to get of the benefits - if they are just high enough to be inspiring for returning - and low enough for players to not go on "Auto mode" for increased benefit.
  2. Loki Blue

    Loki Blue Well-Known Member

    May 1, 2017
    If your friends are annoyed with you for having a life, they're not your friends. I can't imagine "neighbors" being annoyed with you for having a life. If they are, maybe they need to get one. ;)

    In all seriousness, though, 24 hours is entirely too short a period of time. People have needs, and sometimes those needs take them away from the game for days, even weeks at a time. Sometimes more. And it's a fact of life that people get tired. There are things in this game that need to be fixed, things that players have been asking for for a couple of years now. There's two of the reasons why players leave...if the developers want to keep those players from leaving in the first place, they can start by listening to what they're asking for, and making it happen. Enticements only work for a brief time.
  3. Hugs

    Hugs Active Member

    Feb 8, 2017
    Ye, well, I believe you are right :( - there are things we have been asking for - that did not even get a reply from developers - making it clear they are not that interested in what we are thinking.
    I just recently looked at the last live event, where they said that they were actually reading the forums, and that made me hope for a short time, maybe, just maybe they had changed - and that they would actually be interested in helping to patch up some of the big holes through people leave the game.

    Yes, it is true that people have real lives, and that you sometimes are taken away from the game for some time. What better then than to discover when you return that you have something to play with and make you progress in some way. - or what discouragement to discover that a lot of what you were working on, were now gone again.
    It might be that some of what I suggested should kick in faster i.e. after 24 hours, while other things kick in later - like after a week.
    And, some, like the relic and formula fragments should maybe be to everyone, regardless of if they were playing actively or not?

    What do you think? What would help on stopping the leaking of players from the game?
    It is often said that it is much cheaper to keep a customer than to get a new one. So, I do believe that working to keep players are cheaper than using marketing to get new ones. What is your best tips?
  4. Karvest

    Karvest Well-Known Member

    Nov 30, 2017
    just freeze decay after few days of inactivity.
  5. Loki Blue

    Loki Blue Well-Known Member

    May 1, 2017
    There is absolutely nothing that can be done to prevent players from leaving a game--any game--if they feel it is time to move on. People quit jobs for better ones, move to other places, change vehicles...etc. It's just part of life.

    Ultimately, you've answered your own question there, which brings me back to my statement

    I think this is far more important than any "enticements".

    And what you've detailed in your suggestion there is basically a self-playing city. There's no reason for me to do anything in my city except leave for two weeks or so, then come back and reap the benefits, then leave again. What would be the point in playing the game when the game plays itself? ;)
    Aramina likes this.
  6. edeba

    edeba Well-Known Member

    Sep 17, 2017
    Good idea. I've not been away from the game for more than a day since I started, but really, this is a good point, if you are away for two weeks vacation, your stockpiles are slaughtered. It was never decay that kept me playing, but rather, collecting goods and doing the tournament.

  7. calenmir

    calenmir Well-Known Member

    Jan 31, 2017
    But it must also include something - like knowing it's in auto mode, so that they can delete dead cities. Real dead cities. I'm so tired of dead cities.

    So what is length of time you can be away before being removed (if they're even still doing that)? And given how they handle the implementation of anything (like for instance the spire that they were so hyped on delivering that very little of it was ready when they did roll it out - like manual fighting and convincing) it would likely leave dead cities on the map indefinitely. That's a real problem for new folks and a likely a big reason why they lose so many players. Had Sinya Arda been my first city I would have quit immediately, but because I already had 5 other cities I knew what to do and how to succeed. The dead cities must factor into this (which is a very good idea) before it's rolled out - otherwise no one will ever be removed because they'll continue to appear active.

    Edited to add: yes I know this is beta, but that doesn't change the need to factor this in.
  8. Loki Blue

    Loki Blue Well-Known Member

    May 1, 2017
    Yes, dead cities are still removed via the in-game algorithm. It just seems to take forever, although, I recently lost a multitude of dead neighbors, and only had coin pits for a brief time. They're all filled up now with active newer cities. However, that's countered by the Chapter 4 and higher cities that haven't been active in the two years I've been here. :p
    calenmir likes this.
  9. Hugs

    Hugs Active Member

    Feb 8, 2017
    Well, if it is a self playing city or not will depend on what "playing Elvenar" is consisting of inside your head. Inside of my head the game is about growing my city, learning new upgrades or strengths, puzzling the buildings together so I get a good balance, trying to have enough resources for what I wanted to do and so on. I understand from your response that in your head "playing Elvenar" consists of collecting stuff and little more. For me that is the prerequisites for what I consider the "playing".
  10. Loki Blue

    Loki Blue Well-Known Member

    May 1, 2017
    You misunderstand then. If that were the case, I wouldn't be nearing the end of Woodelves.
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2019
  11. soleil

    soleil Well-Known Member

    Apr 7, 2019
    To me, this is no more than having a bot, not a fan of this suggestion at all. Players who come back, come back on their own. I've left the game several times and rebuilt all of my cities from level 1 numerous times. I didn't need an incentive to come back because the game is worth coming back to.

    What they need is more reasons for people to stay. More activities.
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2019
    Loki Blue likes this.
  12. Brummbaer

    Brummbaer Well-Known Member

    May 19, 2015
    I totally agree with soleil.
    It is importent to hold players in the game and not to leave and ask for return
    In other games a small daily login gift is offered, no offer to return.
    slide, soleil and Loki Blue like this.
  13. Hugs

    Hugs Active Member

    Feb 8, 2017
    With your responses it sounds like what I am asking is a lot... - let's say my main hall is level 25... - that means that if I am away for a bit more than a week, I will recieve 25 formula fragments and 1 relic. I will have 16-17 knowledge points, and be able to collect maybe 160% more gold and tools of a one-day production, and approx 130% of two-days production of goods - and slightly more than the decay of decaying goods.
    If you were to log in one more time during that week, you would more or less be certain to get more goods, more gold and tools, grow the amount of decaying goods rather than just barely keeping up, and if you during that time did one tournament province, you would probably get one formula you can disenchant for more formula fragments as well as minimum 1 relic. My intention was all the time that it should be clearly beneficial to log in - but also that my neighbours should get more of the benefit they deserve for logging in and giving neighbourly help. If you noticed, I said that priority would be builder and then culture. After the builder is filled up, if the neighbour does not log in, the help I gave to the culture would be gone again before he log in. So, that too, would be more helpful for those who log in. I will however feel good that the knowledgepoints I was supposed to get if I were a bit more active, has hopefully benefitted someone else. Chances are that I have put only one knowledgepoint in a certain ancient wonder, and this is rarely not enough to get anything in return. That is fine.
    For you who already are active, and have a lot of time availiable, I can understand that you ask for more activities. For me, where other factors compete on my time, there is more than enough activities in the game... - sometimes it even dread me to see that another event that you are supposed to work on has come... Sometimes the game feel like a burden of work... - and the punishment for wanting to play in more slow motion seems to be a challenge. It's a nice game, but I do not have sevral hours to work through the game each day... Some days I do, but not every single day.
  14. soleil

    soleil Well-Known Member

    Apr 7, 2019
    @Hugs I think the problem most of us have with this is auto-play and enticing players to come back if they have left the game. Again, for me, I’ve left the game so many times, there will be a point where I say "okay no more" because they aren’t adding more stuff for me to do and I won’t come back.

    If you’re asking for something based on how you play, that’s a whole different story. And that should be the focus. Focus on suggestions that help you, you can’t control what happens with your neighbors if they’re not logging in to get culture benefits. They should be on here asking for things. That is why we’re here.

    This is the link to the Amethyst Phoenix suggestion.

    There are a lot of suggestions in this that could help someone like you. Like being able to change production rates to 1 hour during the day you’re on. Or suggest to change it to 7 days productions. Karvest mentioned freezing decay. There is a wonder or two that help with decay. Make that suggestion on the thread. One that helps with neighborly visits. Wonders are a big part of our game.
    Loki Blue likes this.
  15. Hugs

    Hugs Active Member

    Feb 8, 2017
    Well, I understand this is a lost battle. I probably also worded myself badly. The main part of the "auto-mode" was more for the other players than for me.
    The remainding was more equal to a nice little gift you get once a week, and frankly - I thought - why don't everyone get this gift once a week?

    My main motivation for writing this suggestion is - I like the game, but sometimes it feels a bit overwhelming with work, and I have a lot of other things that I need to spend my time on, so I do not get the time to log on to my city and do the work that needs to be done. With each passing day that I do not log on, I get more and more discouraged by the thought of all that I need to take care of to get back to where I left the city... Decay is ofc. one of the bigger reasons why it gets more and more of a barrier to log on again. But then you also have the tournaments... - there might be one specific relic I badly need more of, because I am nearly out, but, I am in no shape to prepare and gather enough resources and goods in time, and make sure I am fully prepared to do a lot in the week this specific relic is up. Maybe I don't even have the time or energy to jump in at that time... - and then there is 9 weeks until next time. :(

    Anyway - I understand my suggestions are shunned - but, unfortunately - it seems like I cannot delete the post once it is posted. :(
    Eventually I will probably be gone from the game, but, that is no loss, as I can understand, the game don't need players like me. :(
  16. Loki Blue

    Loki Blue Well-Known Member

    May 1, 2017
    @Hugs, this is the kind of game that doesn't need attention every single day...no matter how it may seem that it does. Many players are on several times a day, every day, but that's their play style, and not everyone plays the same way. It's alright if you don't log in every day. Trust me. :)

    The cities around you honestly don't need "auto-help". They're not going to suffer when you're away, because they have Fellowships, and get visits from other neighbors. It was very kind of you to consider them, but really, "auto-help" is not a good idea. Many players have a preference of where the aid to their city goes. If the "auto-help" can not read (sometimes translate) and follow the directions of the player it is visiting, it's not really helping those players. If there is no direction given in the City Title, that's fine, but if there is, and "auto-help" does not follow it...well, you don't want to log back in to a mail box full of angry messages, do you? Of course not. That's why if I happen to aid the wrong thing, I leave a message of apology. Directions in the City Title can be confusing. "Auto-help" would have to understand this, for example:


    And then, there are things like this:


    Clearly, she doesn't need help. :p

    Those events we have aren't requirements, and nothing bad is going to happen if you don't participate in them. I know it's hard not to, but it's quite alright to sit it out if you'd rather just work on your city. There's one every few months, anyway, and some past event prizes show up again in future events, and some can be crafted. So no worries. :) I love events so much that I have a secondary Beta city that has event rewards for nearly two years of events. Yes, sometimes I get sick of events.

    When it comes to making suggestions, don't take it personally if someone doesn't agree with you or or like your idea. Unless someone tells you, "I hate you and your idea is stupid" (which is against Forum rules and will get them Modded), it's nothing personal. Responding to someone like this:
    is not going to get you support for your idea. ;) Ideas and suggestions rely on the support of fellow forum members in order for the Community Mods to pass said ideas and suggestions on to the developers for consideration, if they meet the requirements. You asked what I thought, and I told you. Your response seemed a tad insulting, even if you didn't mean it that way. I didn't hold it against you, but another player might see that response and decide not to support your idea. You don't know which players are looking at your suggestions, and how they may feel, so sometimes it's best to ask someone what they mean before you assume. :)

    One of the reasons players, established players for example, down-vote ideas is because they look at the bigger picture and take into consideration what kind of impact something may have on the game, especially in the long-term. And you also have to keep in mind that someone has to code these things. People who have no coding experience (or no game coding experience) often think things are easy-peasy, but some things are simply not possible, or the difficulty of a thing makes it unfeasible. So again, it's not necessarily that they think your idea is worthless, it's that they're looking at it from a different perspective.

    You can always tag @Marindor or @Scoobydoo, and ask them to delete your thread if you really want to, but I think that would be a mistake. You never know if someone later on might like something in your idea, put it with an idea of their own and make something else out of it. But it's your thread, so it's up to you. If you want to go that's up to you, but why leave a game just because some random people on a forum didn't fall in love with your idea? Very rarely does an idea get 100% support first time around, and some ideas never get any traction at all. Don't quit a game because of that.