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Discussion [Discussion] Release Notes version 1.22

Marindor

Well-Known Member
Hi guys,

Thanks once again for your feedback. For the point about inactive players: We will forward this feedback to be looked into more deeply.

@Vhadyrian : About the 1.23 update: We're still working on some bigger issues which we need to have fixed first before being able to release it on Beta. I can't really give you any more news than the fact that we're working on it very hard and want to release it as soon as we have been able to resolve these issues.
 

DeletedUser1627

Guest
Thank you @Marindor !
If what I see on the Inno Games TV February Episode is true, the devs wants to add the entire chapter with this update (with ancient wonders)
And because they wanted to make something else with the university, it's normal that it takes a lot of time :)
I only hope that the 1.23 update will arrive before friday :) (and hope the wiki or the city builder will be update also ;))
 

DeletedUser1721

Guest
@Marindor
I would also like to see a revision of early chapter quests. I KNOW of the GZ zone. New players need an ingame warning. And perhaps a quest of NOT scouting for 24 hours.
My new city on beta would have had a horrible surplus of provinces if I was just following the quests, as the quest to finish a province just kept on popping up, so even though I knew to keep it down, I already was past the 10 needed for chapter 2 long before even getting close to the end of chapter 1, especially since so many troops are now provided (150 squads) to starting players.
Very, very much this. This, plus research. That one research which requires 250 of each tier 2 good, immediately after tier 2 goods are unlocked... it's not possible to hit that one with 750 of your tier 2 goods to trade to end up with 250 of each saved up by the time you're done researching it, at least in my experience. Not with the maximum provinces allowed at that level. Maybe if you were in a fellowship and the timing of tournaments was such that you had a boosted week for your tier 2 good and participated in the tournament prior to reaching that research, but I'm not sure if even that would be enough. On every city I've made so far, I've ended up having to buy goods from teh wholesaler to get enough. Now that's not an option... perhaps this should be revised?
 

DeletedUser613

Guest
What is the point of adding new updates when Inno games has made it impossible for existing players to progress
Trian troops - but they are not able to beat any unconquered provinces on the map
therefore no room for expansion
Buy goods to expand - cost per sector of a province is astronomical and with the adjustments to wholesalers the spare coins you have can not buy the necessary goods that you need
Tech tree - you now can not produce enough goods in 2 quarters to progress through one chapter
Please sort the battles and tech tree and reverse the changes to the wholesalers before introducing new content
 

Heymrdiedier

Well-Known Member
Every time i see an extra bug fix version i get very excited.
Only then to get dissapointed again, why is this one still not fixed?
https://beta.forum.elvenar.com/inde...academy-giving-a-rune-orc-on-position-2.6644/

This seems like an easy one to fix, unless if you want to compensate the players who got the wrong rune, then it gets very complicated. But id rather have no compensation and the bug fixed, then have to wait much longer. Even tho i can build these, i hestitate cause i cant help my fellow members to get the runes when im upgrading it.
 

Hugs

Active Member
Sadly, the new wholesaler will IMHO, serve to discourage new players. The trader lists a lot of 50K trades, but the new guy who wants to trade 50 units of boosted for 50 he needs to move forward can see his trade listed and untaken for 24 hours or longer. Not quite that bad on live servers, but still small trades seem to beneath the dignity of many players. We need the wholesaler to be the balance to that problem.
I am a fairly new player, from a country with in total less than 3,5k players, where half of them are already dead, or close to dead, and maybe only 50% have completed chapter 1... If I were to want to do a good job in a tournament, I need to wake up early on Thursday to make 2 rounds that day to get 6 rounds in total... - problem is... - the trader will only allow me to trade with players in a limited range of where my city is (usually 3-6 pages of trades, some rare times maybe up to 20 pages)... - and ofc. there is noone else around to supply me with the goods I need, even when I have some goods to offer for the trade. And, in the second half of a tournament, there is nothing left of the basic good most needed - of any amount. If the old wholesaler had been there, I might have been able to finish the 3rd or maybe even 4th province on that round, now I cannot even buy enough for 1 of the negotiations! I would have loved to have a player like Philplessis or an equally kind around, that would be able to buy my offers and provide me with the goods I needed. It would make the game so much better. Who could fill up with goods at the trader at fair prices and buy offers when we were really short on everything but just to get a little bit further.
I don't understand this that 13 circles should be too much? - is it so that the city then gets so big, it's hard to load it in? Why then don't make a new technology that gives you a "hidden place" inside the mountain or something, where the other players cannot see or visit, where you can grow something useful "inside-mountain-goods", to make nice magic there, that way dividing the city into pieces, where the outside visible city is of a loadable type?
To make up better for the trader so that both the big and small stacks can be traded, all that has to be done are to let people list 50 trades of 50 boosted basic goods traded for a similar amount of needed basic goods - as one action done. Then, all theese equal trades gets listed as 1, and the buyer be enabled to choose with say a slider how many stacks of the offered trade he wants to buy... - equal offers from different players might even be mixed together in that single trade-offer-line.
The wholesaler changes is surely something that strongly deter me as a fairly new player (to the degree that I have started to consider not playing much more)... - so, if it also deter those who have been playing for a while, who does it serve? - those who don't want us to play the game?
 

Hugs

Active Member
My current stock of non boosted goods :
Marble : 871k
Steel : 554k
Crystal : 290k
Scroll : 490 k
Elixir : 137k
Gems 301k

I constantly put trades up and pick up whatever I can to get non boosted good. I accept all trades unless my boosted goods drop under 100k, at which time I wait to produce more. All this stock was built pretty much without using the wholesaler at all.

I really think that peoples who use the wholesaler actually did build their cities with using the wholesaler in mind, and that's why it hits them so hard, because it is totally possible to play without even using it. Put some trades up. You will end up WAAAAY richer using the trader than using the wholesaler.

Everyone understands quickly that using the wholesaler is a much worse deal than using the trader. But, when there is none around to trade with the wholesaler is who can save your day. I don't have your amounts of goods, if I can get as much as 4k of each of the basic goods, I feel extremely rich - and ... go out spending most of it, negotiating through a new province, leaving me back with less goods again. And, I DO produce as much goods as I can... - it's just, I am not at your stage in the game... - and as a new player on a small server, I need the old wholesaler back. The new one is killing.
 

Hugs

Active Member
With all the devs' emphasis on trading with players rather than using the wholesaler, and interacting with players, I have to wonder if they even play the game.

...... Page five is more of the same, but it also includes a bunch of 100 magic dust for 1600 marble trades (lol).

Sorry for cutting short your long and good post, but... - I have seen several stating that offering tier 3 goods asking for 16 times this in tier 1 goods is a "lol"-trade. Now, I have just recently unlocked tier 3, and I have been thinking all the time that since this is what the game suggests as a good fair trade, it is so... Why is this a kind of trade a trade that is seemingly unfair and offending to you?
 

DeletedUser1721

Guest
Sorry for cutting short your long and good post, but... - I have seen several stating that offering tier 3 goods asking for 16 times this in tier 1 goods is a "lol"-trade. Now, I have just recently unlocked tier 3, and I have been thinking all the time that since this is what the game suggests as a good fair trade, it is so... Why is this a kind of trade a trade that is seemingly unfair and offending to you?
It's because the amount of goods of lower tiers that is needed to trade for even small amounts of tier 3 goods is ridiculously unfair. For example, on my main city, one magic dust manufactory produces 1260 magic dust in three hours, and takes up 1900 population, 460 culture, 20 tiles of space, and gives 2360 ranking points.
One planks manufactory takes 1150 population, 250 culture, ten tiles of space, and gives 1400 ranking points. So, about two thirds the population, two thirds the culture, and two thirds the ranking points, all in something half the size as one tier 3 manufactory. The goods production is 770 planks per three hours. Again, two thirds that of the magic dust manufactory. However, the game considers goods from tier 1 manufactories to be worth ONE SIXTEENTH as much as goods from tier 3 manufactories. The sticking point isn't where the devs think it is... they think it's in the coins and supplies needed to produce the resources, but as much as they're emphasizing careful use of space when building cities, the limiting factor is in the time needed to produce goods. With six planks manufactories and four magic dust manufactories, my city produces 4620 planks and 5040 magic dust every three hours.

So at that point, the question becomes "why should I trade a third of an entire three hour production of tier 1 goods for one fiftieth of an entire three hour production of this person's tier 3 goods?". The tier 3 trader is offering almost nothing, for a significantly larger portion of the lower tier trader's output.
 
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DeletedUser1657

Guest
I have seen several stating that offering tier 3 goods asking for 16 times this in tier 1 goods is a "lol"-trade... Why is this a kind of trade a trade that is seemingly unfair?

There are 3 main aspects:
  • Cost - 16:1 is equal as that reflects the coins/supplies invested
  • Factory space - 16:1 is completely unfair
  • Time - 16:1 is completely unfair
Some people vary their stance depending on frequency and a players town. For example a low level town doing a one-off trade to get needed goods verse a town who deleted all T1 factories and relies on cross-tier trades.

The change to the wholesaler sees me buying more T3 goods as I don't wish to pay the additional fee for a second round offer. It has the potential to murky the waters as you wouldn't want to spend coins or supplies at the wholesaler for those and then get a much reduced ratio trading for T2 or T1 that you may want/need, you would possibly have been better of paying for the inflated rates anyway.
 

DeletedUser613

Guest
I produce all boosted goods in my city, but still never have sufficient
4 plank manufactories - approx 18000 planks every 9 hours
4 silk manufactoies - approx 18000 silk every 9 hours
3 magic dust manufactories - approx 14000 dust every 9 hours
 

DeletedUser1767

Guest
It's because the amount of goods of lower tiers that is needed to trade for even small amounts of tier 3 goods is ridiculously unfair. For example, on my main city, one magic dust manufactory produces 1260 magic dust in three hours, and takes up 1900 population, 460 culture, 20 tiles of space, and gives 2360 ranking points.
One planks manufactory takes 1150 population, 250 culture, ten tiles of space, and gives 1400 ranking points. So, about two thirds the population, two thirds the culture, and two thirds the ranking points, all in something half the size as one tier 3 manufactory. The goods production is 770 planks per three hours. Again, two thirds that of the magic dust manufactory. However, the game considers goods from tier 1 manufactories to be worth ONE SIXTEENTH as much as goods from tier 3 manufactories. The sticking point isn't where the devs think it is... they think it's in the coins and supplies needed to produce the resources, but as much as they're emphasizing careful use of space when building cities, the limiting factor is in the time needed to produce goods. With six planks manufactories and four magic dust manufactories, my city produces 4620 planks and 5040 magic dust every three hours.

So at that point, the question becomes "why should I trade a third of an entire three hour production of tier 1 goods for one fiftieth of an entire three hour production of this person's tier 3 goods?". The tier 3 trader is offering almost nothing, for a significantly larger portion of the lower tier trader's output.
And on top of that, the amount of goods a player actually needs for things are not operating on a 16:1 ratio either. When you exchange a dollar for four quarters, that's equal value because a dollar can purchase four times as much as a quarter can, so the exchange value is rightly 4:1. But in Elvenar, when you use goods to buy or upgrade, more or less the same number of goods will be needed in both cases (I have not done the math, but you very obviously do not need sixteen times as many Tier I goods), so the goods themselves have roughly equal purchasing powers when you go to use them. Therefore, it is not the case that a small amount of Tier III goods goes a long way. It goes about the same distance as Tier I goods do. Even when you're negotiating or catering a province, where you do need more Tier I goods than Tier III, you do not need sixteen times more of them.
 

Hugs

Active Member
Thank you for explaining this to me :) Your logic makes me see much better that you are right, and, I simply had not understood. I honestly thought the trade to be fair, but, now I know that I should reconsider on how to do trading, so that it will be more fair with those I trade with :)
At the moment, I am mostly limited by coins and supplies available, as I want to have many factories in order to get as good as possible a production I can... - so, I had not yet realized how it will be when I have a much better production boost, and even higher level buildings, and sufficient with coins, supplies and population... when only space and time will be the limiting factor :)
 
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