Cheaters / pushing :)

[DeletedUser2825]

Hallo, theres been a lot of talk on the local Danish forum about cheaters / pushing, it started a year ago, and nothing's really happen, i think some got a warnings, and some still cheating, so just want to ask is this normal also worldwide?

It feels like walking into a casino, where cheating is allowed, and Innogames also pushing the players to cheat to beat the cheaters, because they dont do anything about it, and it kinda getting out of hand, so now everybody is cheating and i kinda the outlaws wild west, and Inno is happy when the dollars keep rolling ind Well they know it a year ago, but dont did anything about it

We tried forum / support and that doesn't seems to work for a year now, so now i try complaining here, but i guess this a wast of time too

Greetings Bumblebee Bee )

 

[PrimroseSylvia]

In my live server some pushing accounts have been banned, at least some months ago; not so many as we like to, but it happened.

 

[DeletedUser2825]

In my live server some pushing accounts have been banned, at least some months ago; not so many as we like to, but it happened.

Thanks thats nice to know, that Inno really can do something about it, and was felling a little hopeless never seen a ban here, even if they got a hole FS with pushing accounts, and supports just keep saying, they waiting orders from the headquarters

 

[DeletedUser2825]

And ohh... I forgot to ask, was it just the pushing account that got banned? and not they main account? and if not did they keep all the KP in they AW so they still got superpowers?

 

[PrimroseSylvia]

Do you know that we're breaking forum's rules, in this discussion?
My answer would be an hope signal, but I can't tell you what you want to know because I really don't know; the only thing I know for sure is that a player came into our forum complaining about these bans.

 

[DeletedUser2825]

Hehe i don't see the big issues, breaking the forum rules, when Inno don't do any things about the game rules on my server

 

[DeletedUser2670]

Honestly, some hope would be nice...
We tried to do something about pushing a few months ago on live server where I play, but it didn't go so well. Only the pushing accounts were banned, the accounts that were being pushed were left untouched. The response from pushers was basically: "We don't care, we'll just make new accounts and continue pushing". There was even a screenshot of one of the pushers confessing that he got a few thousand KP per week from tournaments. But it looks like the community manager and some of the pushers are friends, so that may be a reason...
We even tried to take it directly to Inno... Their response was that we should turn to the community manager for our language version (yes, the one with "interesting" friends). Isn't that a bit like calling your ISP that your internet connection hasn't been on for a few days and them telling you, that they only accept complaints and repair requests by e-mail?
Soon after that, players from our fellowship got a few warnings from support that we are pushing/pushed accounts, even a few bans were handed out. We were using endless chain KP swapping method at the time and communication with support seemed to suggest that we need to ballance it out more, so that we get as many KP from each player as we give to them. A few players quit, many others stopped using endless chain at that point and we started doing 1:1 swaps with players or using supplemented self leveling.
So no, I'm not holding out hope that something will be done about the pushing.

 

[UlyssesBlue]

Push accounts seem to be pretty common on the servers I play on, and nothing ever seems to happen when they get reported, despite Inno always going on about how pushing isn't allowed. The pushed accounts always get massive benefits with no consequences, and those of us who play by the rules are left behind in the dust.

 

[DeletedUser2825]

Oh no, now i am felling hopeless again
I get the picture now, Inno are so proud over having +100 million registered players, they tell to their investors, but half of them are pushing account hehe
And now i just fell a little stupid, spending my money on this game, but i keep on. I like this game, and waiting for a miracle

 

[DeletedUser607]

yes.

german server: very high pushed accounts, with easily visible pushees ;-). reaction: close to none.

dutch server: as far as I know, it's even worse over there.

@Humlebumlebi well, inno should consider that situation: sure, pushers are investing money into the game. but other players are drawn away from such a situation, refusing to pay money...

so, the simple question is: who will pay more (long term). I would say, the regular players who do not like pushing.

 

[Marindor]

Hi guys, without getting into specific cases (which is actually not allowed on the forums), I can say this about it in general: Multi-accounts are permitted by the rules, agressive pushing is not. The only advise we can give you guys, is to report your suspicions to your local support teams. They can then start an investigation and if they find conclusive evidence/proof that accounts are indeed purely created for pushing purposes, they will take the appropriate steps. Please keep in mind though that this is not always so easy to proof and that proper investigations can sometimes take a very long time (it might even take more than a year before finally something conclusive shows up). Also, the support teams won't be allowed to share any details with you about steps that have been taken to other accounts/players. Permanent banning is indeed one of those steps, but it's basically the most heavy one so before taking such extreme measures, it could be that reported players have been punished in different ways (which they're probably not proud of and won't share with others by themselves). As mentioned above in other reactions, steps are being taken against pushing and sometimes unfortunately, when players really don't want to listen and learn, it means that our support teams will have to permanently ban them, but it's a complex and long process that mainly takes place on the background, since we're not going to openly put people to shame. So once again, please keep reporting your suspicions and provide your support teams with as much actual proof you have as possible, and they will take up the matter and act accordingly.

 

[UlyssesBlue]

Multi-accounts are permitted by the rules, agressive pushing is not.

Is this implying that moderate or mild pushing is allowed? Where does the line lie?

I would argue that all types of pushing should not be allowed, and any multi accounts should be operated as entirely separate entities that have nothing to do with each other, no exceptions. That's the only way to ensure things are fair, and no one gets an advantage from having multiple accounts.

 

[CrazyWizard]

Just for the record I got the first reports of german acount getting a "temporary ban" as early as the start of june last year,
Before that I also recieved a report from the Italian server a bit prior to that.

Just report them and they eventually will get punished, it's that in most accounts you will not see it directly.
For example what I was told is that they got temporarily banned untill they removed there push accounts and agreed tot not do it again.

If you get caught again, I'll guess the punishment will be more severe with possibly a prolonged temporary ban, but as no one (or someone in there vicinity) being caught twice has told me I cannot be sure.

 

[PrimroseSylvia]

Before that I also recieved a report from the Italian server a bit prior to that.

Yeah, on May 2018.

I think that banning [temporarily] pushing accounts could be a warning, but if you get caught a second time you know that you are breaking game rules so not only pushing account have to be permanent banned, but all resources received by pushed account should be deleted (for example, deleting all kp invested in ancient wonders); this is the only way to really send a strong signal that crime doesn't pay.

 

[DeletedUser607]

They can then start an investigation and if they find conclusive evidence/proof that accounts are indeed purely created for pushing purposes, they will take the appropriate steps.

And here lies the problem.

Some pushers that I know of actually did not start their push-accounts. FS-members have quit playing and offered their accounts.

So, let's say, player 1 plays account A, and got his hands on account B and C. due to him playing in different worlds, he then could open cities in worlds, where B and C were not playing.

1. account B and C will look at least in one world as being actively played (and maybe the cheater even does that), yet the main purpose of the accounts is still cheating. furthermore, playing the events is helpful for getting wishing-wells, therefor diamonds and extra KP.
2. since it happens cross-worlds, it's hard to see for regular players and probably even supporters who are investigating.

so I would consider loosening the definition, aggressive pushing is okay, but purely created for pushing is a too harsh definition.


EDIT: to innos defence: the player, thom I have observed doing this actually got a long term ban, is active now and seems to be "clean". yet, a martial monastery lvl 30 is still a huge advantage (yet he seems to lack other fight-related AWs, maybe the punishment was deleting them).

 

[Deleted User - 62044]

I have at the live server two accounts, one of mine and one of my husband but we have different fellowship and different neighborhood so we can not work together.

a simple solution to this problem would be that the same ip can share a fellowship or neighborhood, this would limit the use, I think.

 

[DeletedUser607]

The solution with the IP has worked in the past

but now, a lot of providers are using provider grade NAT (especially the cellphone-providers).

that leads to the unfortunate situation, that people share an IP, who don't even know of each other. and statistically, there'll be several elvenar-players sharing IPs, and statistically some will interact. auto-banning them is not a good solution.

I know this, because I was involved in another browsergame long time ago, and we had the case, that two players got banned. they showed up in the support-IRC-channel (not together), and when the second person explained what was going on, we got an idea about what has happened: they were students at the same (german) university, playing in different computer-rooms, yet sharing an IP. one attacked the other, ban for both.

so, IPs are not a good idea to determine relationships between accounts.

EDIT: oh, and fun fact: today, lots of users have just an IPv6-range, but share an IPv4. depending if inno has an AAAA-record (IPv6-address in host-information), these players would either have a ton of different addresses, with randomization even an address for each computer-reboot, or many players will share one IPv4.

 

[palmira]

We had a player in my live server that got at least one warning, continued pushing and got permanently banned; another one got one warning, her push accounts disappeared and continues playing. These are the ones I know about I presume there are more cases. So cheaters are indeed being punished

 

[Jackluyt]

Be aware that the is a big difference between 'Push' and 'Alt' accounts

Push Accounts are created solely to feed goods and KP to a master account - and that is not allowed.

Alt Accounts are where a player has more than one city - but plays each / all of them as stand-alone entities.
This is allowed to accommodate:
1. People who would like to have two cities one human and one elf - and play them off against each other
2. Family members who use the same computer and / or same IP address and would like to compete against one another in the same fellowship.
3. Other similar and innocent reasons.

There is no harm in 'alt' accounts - and having one is not 'cheating' (even though the fine print of the player contract might say otherwise; lawyers tend to use rather severe language when writing contracts, to cover the company's rights in any circumstance, should it be necessary to ban someone for unacceptable behaviour).