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Discussion Spire of Eternity

DeletedUser778

Guest
So my feedback after finishing stage 1+2:
The concept is quite interesting BUT
I lost a huge amount of units
I got one set piece that alone is not very usefull
a couple of diamonds, kp and time instants, which are probaly used up already, because of the stupid time barriers.
Otherwise quite useless stuff especially quite a lot of spell fragments, which are - at least in my case - really useless with summonings worth 234070 fragments and enchantments worth 445740 (excluding catalysts and food) in inventory and so little usefull recipes in the academy,
so currently for me it's just a big troop sinkhole with little to nothing worth.
 

charlemagne3

Active Member
It would be helpful to number these encounters. It was suggested that I ask for help to determine what combination is needed to possibly win. I guess I can count down from the big chest - so not counting the big chest I have 12 more to get through to get to it, so I haven't been able to get very far. I don't remember how many I have finished albeit not very many and even to do those few I had to try several times. It doesn't seem I can look back down the tower to determine how many I finished.

So for this encounter I've tried archer and treant only...tried them with something else as well - all to no avail (had to hover over these silly things to remember what they are) - have not enough treant left to try again. Looks like even completing another chest will be impossible.

So maybe a label or sign on each chest that gives level number and encounter number. will make it easier to ask for help.

It appears to me that this new feature is designed for the war mongers - those that have 4 and 5 armories maxed out and all the related AW's. And the folks that have that many armories and all the AW's are usually the ones that have completed all the chapters and are sitting idle waiting for the next chapter.
 

SoggyShorts

Well-Known Member
This kind of thing has often been discussed on the live forums and it seems to me that you too SoggyShorts, you had a suggestion going in this direction.
Don't get me wrong, I want there to be a FS portion for the spire ASAP, I just don't have much faith that it will be what you or I call "soon"
I am a small player and I do not fight, this is not for us, it's over, I do not lose a second more in this invention for rich and bored players, I am modest and I have a lot of city to build and many races to discover, hopefully the rich boring players have fun because the poor players are out of our range.
1. I'm a bored player at the end of the tech tree with a very significant military and I'm stuck on the first fight on stage
2.The developers first run is not perfect so we are giving feedback to help make it better
 
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CrazyWizard

Well-Known Member
its more or less for every map, map 3 has only 8% more enemy squad size then yours, so still around round 2 of tournament province

Thats closer to round 3 than it's to round 1-2.
Even if the fights are easy and the losses are limited, if the squad size is huge, then even small losses in a fight result to big losses on your troops.

Also not everyone is an expert in manual fighting, and if a small mistake will lead to huge losses. you can do the math.
In the multi wave fights the difficulty is much higher than round 3, the first battle yes the battle difficulty might be 108%, but the the second battle because of some losses becomes more like 120+% and the 3rd then becomes 180+%. than on top of your losses you have to accept that in the second/3rd wave you might encounter a whole different set of units, so the units from wave 1 that you used might suck in round 2 adding even more difficulty.
This is the main reason that on auto mode these fights are even impossible.
So the diffuculty is much higher that you depict here.
And thats not even considering that because of initiative of some units you will always incurr serious losses (example a mistwalker/light ranged shoot first in a fight dominated by strategists and some heavy melee. so you will always incurr heavy losses on your priest/blossom mages)

Combine those losses that with many times your SS and darn that hurts.

Last but not least, how many tournament fighters beside yourself have you met that just love manual fighting?
Because I really haven't met that many.

And what you just told is you need to do 46 encounters manually, as it won't be playable on auto mode without incurring ridicule losses.
I think with this aproach the're shooting themselves in the foot, In it's current state, assuming manual fighting is possible, and negotiating has a similar diffculty compared to the fighting.
To many people dislike manual fighting for it to be a viable option, and 46 of them is a great no-no.
After the first buzz is gone I kinda expect the Spire of Eternity to die out quicker than an unprotected candle in a great storm. no matter how good the rewards.

And that would be such a waste of time and energy spend in developing it.
 

Jaxom

Well-Known Member
I decided to do a poll of my fellowship and guess what. People are trying the spire, getting crushed, and stopping with no plans to return until diplomacy is added or fights are made much easier.

The feedback isn't even about the rewards but only about the impossible fights just a short distance up the spire.

One thing that was brought up was:
So where am I supposed to put all these buildings from events, FA and now spire? Some are nice but there just isn't space for them. Small improvements over what I have aren't worth it. I can't easily drop one thing in to replace another. So why bother with things if I can't use the good rewards?

Anyone else faced with this concern or heard it voiced?
 

DeletedUser2500

Guest
Very disappointed with the Spire. it is just another place to spend troops and if they get it up and running goods. Thought it would be more of a challenge or a puzzle not another drain on my troops. In the real Elvenar world many fellowships go fro 10 chests whenever they can. How will an individual decide to support their spire or their fellowship? There are so many other things that could be done with the spire. To me graphics are great but the game play needs to be rethought for the spire.
 

Loki Blue

Well-Known Member
I guess the real question for me is...what is the purpose of The Spire of Eternity? Yes, obviously it's a diamond sink, so there's the cash draw for Inno. This is to be expected, because this isn't a charitye it's a business. But what is the purpose for the players? We're the ones who will be using it, some of us will be paying for it, but why?

Since you're asking for individual feedback:

Why should I train like a maniac, just to send my troops to their (likely) deaths in the Spire (or throw away my goods/supplies/coins), when I already do that in every single event, in Tournaments, and in regular Province clearing? For the idea of the possibility of a potential 'great prize' I likely will not win? And some other stuff I already get elsewhere? Ah, sorry...no. I get that strategy, and--let's face it--sometimes 'mindless killing' is far easier to design and code than something that is actually challenging and fun. There is already enough combat sim in this game...I seriously don't need any more.

I know the games Inno produces aren't meant to engage players intellectually, but it would be nice to have something thought provoking as a third option. The in-game history of Elvenar has been brought up a few times here and there (as in, why don't we see more of it), and this would be a great opportunity to make use of it. Quite a bit of the history is available in the resources we have, and players are able to search for the answers. Or maybe they've been here long enough to remember. Whatever. So I approach the chest-keeper and I have three options. I can fight, I can attempt to convince the keeper to let me pass, or I can answer their question. The higher I go up the Spire, the more challenging the questions. I can always chose to fight or negotiate if I don't know the answer, or don't feel like looking it up, so I'm not locked in, as it were. If I get the question wrong, I lose nothing and I can try again, or choose to fight, negotiate, or quit. I have the option. I certainly can not speak for anyone else, but I know that would make me happy.
 

ekarat

Well-Known Member
now compare that to free wishing well from grand prizes which require zero effort. only 2 clicks per day

Exactly! This is so much better than that!

This also takes no space and is repeatable weekly, unlike events.

This totally blows events away!
 

Jaxom

Well-Known Member
I do like the sound of that "answer a question" option.

But it would seem to require a user interface that does not currently exist. Based on the length of time we have been waiting for a better interface for Fellowship Adventures it is unlikely to happen.

And I hate to say it but the answers would almost certainly become available through some web site, making solutions trivial thus removing any challenge. Not sure how one could guard against that.
 

Loki Blue

Well-Known Member
And I hate to say it but the answers would almost certainly become available through some web site, making solutions trivial thus removing any challenge. Not sure how one could guard against that.

There's no reason to guard against it, I stated that the answers are available in the resources we have. The player would still have to do a little research if they didn't already know the answer. They could offer a riddle, or a logic puzzle or whatever in addition to questions about Elvenar history, and the question option could be timed.

I'm just asking them to consider giving us something other than what we already have a multitude of.
 

UlyssesBlue

Well-Known Member
spire-fight.jpg

Ok, someone tell me how I can get through this. This is encounter 8 on map 1. My troop options are 2 star sword dancers, 1 star archers, 1 star treants and 1 star golems. I have already tried 5 lots of archers and they all died.
 

DeletedUser724

Guest
my comments
a few run has identify
play tournament or stop playing tournament forever ( not one tournament) or do not play "spire"
too much soldier is used
it affect the ability of normal tournament playing
may go to "try" when manual mode is available and convince is available
 

palmira

Well-Known Member
I don't fight manual, I tried a few times and is very slow and I suck at it so basically now i do the tourneys mostly on the app, so either the automatic fights are fixed, major tweaks on the spire squad sizes are done or we find affordable negotiations or I am done with all the testing on this feature
 

CrazyWizard

Well-Known Member
I guess the real question for me is...what is the purpose of The Spire of Eternity? Yes, obviously it's a diamond sink, so there's the cash draw for Inno. This is to be expected, because this isn't a charitye it's a business. But what is the purpose for the players? We're the ones who will be using it, some of us will be paying for it, but why?

Since you're asking for individual feedback:

Why should I train like a maniac, just to send my troops to their (likely) deaths in the Spire (or throw away my goods/supplies/coins), when I already do that in every single event, in Tournaments, and in regular Province clearing? For the idea of the possibility of a potential 'great prize' I likely will not win? And some other stuff I already get elsewhere? Ah, sorry...no. I get that strategy, and--let's face it--sometimes 'mindless killing' is far easier to design and code than something that is actually challenging and fun. There is already enough combat sim in this game...I seriously don't need any more.

I know the games Inno produces aren't meant to engage players intellectually, but it would be nice to have something thought provoking as a third option. The in-game history of Elvenar has been brought up a few times here and there (as in, why don't we see more of it), and this would be a great opportunity to make use of it. Quite a bit of the history is available in the resources we have, and players are able to search for the answers. Or maybe they've been here long enough to remember. Whatever. So I approach the chest-keeper and I have three options. I can fight, I can attempt to convince the keeper to let me pass, or I can answer their question. The higher I go up the Spire, the more challenging the questions. I can always chose to fight or negotiate if I don't know the answer, or don't feel like looking it up, so I'm not locked in, as it were. If I get the question wrong, I lose nothing and I can try again, or choose to fight, negotiate, or quit. I have the option. I certainly can not speak for anyone else, but I know that would make me happy.

The main problem of this approach is spoilers. Try an awesome MMO oit of the box, then play that same game using spoilers and the challenge is mostly gone.
 

DeletedUser

Guest
View attachment 5920
Ok, someone tell me how I can get through this. This is encounter 8 on map 1. My troop options are 2 star sword dancers, 1 star archers, 1 star treants and 1 star golems. I have already tried 5 lots of archers and they all died.
Steinlings will win this every time. :( I'm stuck at the same place, facing 2 steinlings in wave 2, impossible to win.
 

maxiqbert

Well-Known Member
View attachment 5920
Ok, someone tell me how I can get through this. This is encounter 8 on map 1. My troop options are 2 star sword dancers, 1 star archers, 1 star treants and 1 star golems. I have already tried 5 lots of archers and they all died.
I would try 3 archers and 2 mages
edit (with phenix!)

edit 2 : on a totally different subject : @Muf-Muf any idea if the multiplayer spire is supposed to be a (the?) new form of adventure?
 
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